Video: Vice Presidential Debate from St. Louis (10/2/08)

Here is the entire, unedited Vice Presidential debate between Gov. Sarah Palin and Sen Joe Biden from Washington University in St. Louis, Missouri on October 2nd, 2008. The debate moderator was Gwen Ifill from PBS news. The debate lasted 90 minutes and this is the where you can watch it in full, unedited.

Here is the entire 90 minute, unedited Palin / Biden VP debate video:

Update

Here is the entire debate split in 10 parts from YouTube:

More analysis to come tomorrow..

  • EricF

    Obama/Biden = nothing but lies.

  • I wish Sarah was running for president. She is what America needs. She will be such a breath of fresh air in Washington.

  • U.S.A.

    Biden won this debate. Palin did better but she is dangerous. She should have to buy a ticket to get in the White House!

  • Oog

    There were low expectations for Palin coming in and she did better than expected, but that wasn’t hard to do. Biden came across as strong, and made a strong case against McCain. Palin did not address the questions or Biden on almost every occasion, and instead repeated talking points. She also did not differentiate herself from Bush, which Biden did for Obama’s ticket again and again. Biden clearly won this debate.

  • cb

    John Mccain chose palin so there was an “inside man” in the white house to ensure drilling in Alaska. Palin for president? wow..

  • Kevin

    Biden clearly won and stuck to the issues and facts, Palin was to scripted and to many attacks.

  • Krodis

    Palin didn’t answer a single damn question. She dodged them all. She repeated her talking points ad nauseum, and she played off this “I’m just a small town girl yeehaw” act.

    The fact that anyone thinks Palin won this debate is mind-boggling.

  • Darin Calhoun

    If Sarah was running for President I’d vote for her. The others are the same old same.

  • ObamaForever

    Palin is the scariest thing yet from the Republican party. She is WAY out of her league…….

  • David

    Obama/Biden = nothing but lies.

    moderator is slightly more harsh towards palin

  • manimal347

    Oh dear. Biden probably did win, but to what end? The two candidates basically represent two poles that, considering how polarized our nation is, lie shockingly close to eachother.

  • David II

    Palin is charming and completely void of substance. Wow, what a disappointment. She got lucky that there wasn’t a more diligent moderator with follow up questions.

  • jan

    i dont understand why everyone seems to think that pallin did so great, when all she did was not give a straight answer. or just not answer at all, an every time she went back to engery issues, regardless of what the question was. to me she was just doing more double talk, also her saying that she is like the rest of the middle class is laughable

  • SheilaC

    That is a nice point to bring up Palin being and inside man when it comes to drilling in Alaska. She is all over drilling in our oceans…

  • Kristen

    I’m so excited for President Obama and Vice President Biden to take office! 🙂

  • Karen Ton

    John McCain’s time!

  • OBAMA_SUCKS

    Palin did slighty better and much more appeals to middle class and small town Americans, something the obama biden ticket do not because of old comments.

    Chris, you say
    “My God, can you imagine her taking any kind of leadership role in a 9/11-type disaster?

    God save us from this character.”

    1. She is not going to be president, John Sidney McCain will be and so he especially would lead in a 9/11 moment.
    2. There is no need to bring in *od save us, that is just a stupid thing to say. I for one do not believe you to have a real faith in God and therefore see your comment about God as something you speech but never practice. To be a real person who believes in God you need to follow Gods teachings and that is something YOU definitely do not do and the only real candidate who does is Sarah Palin.

  • Jan

    “i dont understand why everyone seems to think that pallin did so great, when all she did was not give a straight answer. or just not answer at all, an every time she went back to engery issues, regardless of what the question was.”

    You are right but remember her expectation was soooooooo low. She was in the camp for over a month and got stomped on questions with Katie Couric which even all of us posting here could answer. This was not the same Palin which was in all the couric interviews. A Politican is supposed to have the gift b.s. where if you don’t know the answer you can broad stroke it and trick some people into thinking you answered it or answered it enough that only tim russert or chris matthews would call you on it. She didn’t show any traits of this in her interviews prior to this debate. I was shocked she actual had it in her arsenal tonight. Unfortunately that was the majority of her substance in most of the questions. Biden had a lot of substance. And lets say he told one lie. The bulk of everything he said was very tangible and easy to comprehend. He got the message across.
    But to she won i think is extremely delusional and bias.

  • EricF

    seriously, you guys and gals need to learn to think for yourself. wait till the fact checks come out on this debate. i have been saying this all night, even before the debate began… Obama/Biden are nothing but liars. Biden has no shame whatsoever. he stood on that podium with the nation watching and told lie after lie. direct boldfaced lies. undebateable lies.

    im telling you, wait for the fact checks to hit.

    Obamas economic plan is one of certain disaster. the middle class is really going to need those tax breaks when Obama runs company after company out of America and we see hyper inflation as a result of rising tax rates.

    thats real talk, not the “oh i hate the way Palin comes across” nonsense i keep hearing from bitter liberal democrats.

  • Amby

    To jan… Palin is more middle class then Biden could ever think about being. You can find him at the local Home Depot?! Yeah right Biden.
    Tip: If your running your campaign on “change” you shouldn’t say “I aint ever going to change”.
    Obama as president? More like Osama for president. He is such a slick talker, just like the devil. He’ll tell you what you want to hear to get you to do what he wants. Then he’ll leave you with nothing!

  • U.S.A.

    EricF

    Again what were the lies? This is the 2nd time I have ask you and like Palin, you don’t seem to have good answers.

    It is easy to say lies but not so easy when you are asked to post them huh.

  • EricF

    like when Biden said McCain voted the same as Obama on taxing people making $42,000. need more?

  • leaning left

    watching this i have to admit sarah palin really is cute and charming, but i do not vote on cute and charm… i do not appreciate her as a pick, i feel she is an insult to the American people… she claims to be so different from all the other politicians because she doesnt answer the way the media wants her to answer? unbelievable.. i think shes a complete idiot… she did well in this debate simply because my, as were many others, expectations were dug into the ground… she may not be from washington but the main person on the ticket is a staple… as for some here who think we shouldnt judge her as a presidential candidate because she is a vp candidate is simply ridiculous… mccain is not only old but very sick, cant even comb his own hair… chances are higher than ever, god forbid, that shed be needed to fill in… as for biden i cant say enough… i personally would have loved to have seen him rip her to shreads, but i understand that he did what was needed simply because america is too ignorant, “he was too mean and shes a woman”, shes suppose to run this country but if we say what she is, an idiot, we’re sexist… unbelievable

  • voodoofire

    Biden totally ripped Sara apart when he said MCcain aint no Maverick ! it was too funny !

  • voodoofire

    Biden really showed her that MCcsame is NO Maverick !

  • EricF

    well anyway im out of here. i dont belong here anyway seeing as this entire website is slanted towards Obama. the live text chat could have been amazing if not for the idiot Obama supporters spamming to cloud the conversation. just shows the mentality.

  • Mattie Marken

    The fact that John McCain chose Sarah Palin to be the vice President makes me think his judgment is faulty. There are so many other women who are intelligent and competent whom he could have chosen. What was he thinking? She seems dumb as a post.

  • OBAMA_SUCKS

    ** Nuked by Admin **

  • Erin

    Obama/Biden= SCARY.

  • leaning left

    1) to “obama_sucks” she should be considered as a potential presidential candidate.. shes a vp, meaning if, nothing more, mccain, god forbid, passes away, which by the way hes old and sick=very possible, this idiot might be president
    2) to “david II” the moderator was perfect, she was not mean or nasty to anyone… if it were me id wring her by the neck and ask beg her to please answer just one of my questions
    3)to plain ol “david” obama/biden=lies? are you kidding me? i mean both campaigns have lied no doubt about it but not even close to the extent that mccain has… remember the teaching sex to kids? or obama planting 30 lawyers to dig up dirt on palin in alaska? or the obama campaign attacking her family when he let out a statement telling the media to back off? mccain and the rest of the republicans have played this game before… i hate that obama has taken this route… but its quite apparent that he has to… americas too unaware for him not to…

    also cant say enough about biden… great job couldnt have asked for a more perfect performance… i personally would have enjoyed a more brutal shredding but i understand, america is still too sensitive, because if biden had done just that that would be an obvious sign of sexism ~rolls eyes~ maybe mccain not looking at obama was racist? .. i just feel that the selection of palin as vp is smack in the face of america.. shes a complete idiot and woman who vote for her cause shes a woman are idiots and people who agree with her arent that far behind… people compared biden and palin because of eachothers gaffes… tonight we saw the difference… palin has had all the attention, good and bad, its nice to finally see biden shine… he seems as real as it gets…

  • Bastian

    how do i get the video larger/fullscreen?

  • jw

    Biden = substance
    Palin = more or less able to talk. Which of course means she won.

  • Michelle

    Palin could not seem to answer any direct questions. She was off topic, and all she could talk about was Alaska. Everyting else seems scripted.

  • Pony

    Eric F.. I don’t see that it’s this website which is “slanted toward Obama” but the whole country, (and in fact the world)… Let’s look at the track record of the last “regime” shall we? A terror attack that the US was warned about was ignored (see Farenheit 911 again if you’re in any doubt) Then an oil crusade which was sold to us on the biggest lie (weapons of mass insanity) since Clinton happened to “forget” about a certain dirty blue dress – except thousands and thousands didn’t die in that one… The continual hemorrhaging of money into what is now blatantly an un-winnable conflict, and an economy that is tanking so bad it’s making the 1920’s depression look like a head cold, while tax breaks still continue for the ultra rich (who are getting richer) and 99% of the wealth is now controlled by 1% of the US population… Sure.. let’s patch it up by throwing another $700bn at it, so that the rich speculators are protected, while the bank repossesses your house, car and whatever else it can salvage in an effort to try to survive…

    Yeah… the current camp did a great job.. (good times for all huh?) you think Obama’s going to be able to fix it all in a heartbeat.. not a chance, but it will CERTAINLY be a lot more preferable than another Republican fiasco in the whitehouse.. I for one am ready for change… and judging by these comments, and the polls, and world opinion.. I’m certainly not the only one..

    Nice debate tho 🙂

  • Halfmoonatic

    When this is over I pray we all work together for national unity. That means willingness to respect the whole, sacrifice for the majority, and compromise for the betterment of all. Divided we fall. Dont let the media continue dividing us. Voice to them your non acceptance of this “New Media Order”

  • Mary

    It scares me to think that people can watch a candidate blatantly avoid every question and still leave convinced that the other side, and only person with answers to the questions being asked, as well as specific example after example is lying. And that they compare to the devil because they tell you what you want to hear. It is possible that they are telling us what we want because that’s what they plan to do! Listen and change this country which frankly has become an international embarrassment in the past eight years!

    It scares me to think that this race is even close. It scares me to pieces!

  • AFX

    Come on america. Please support OBAMA. He will do change. He is an genuine person. Mccain or mcWAR and palin are no mavericks and liars.
    You need an honest man. Like obama! And bidden seems like a good man.

    Obama will change the world. Not mccain/palin. Please wake up!
    greetings from sweden, and the world is watching..
    obama 08! =)yes we can! unite!

  • votenow

    Who is Sarah kidding? She did not answer a single question. She mentioned energy as though she was knew what she was talking about. This can’t be real!!!

  • davidkim

    First of all, I am going to try my best not to be biased. I have not yet picked a sure candidate for I feel to independent to honestly pick one right now from either side.

    Does anyone see it IRONIC that the moderator is going to be publishing a book by the end of the year on how OBAMA is so great and such!?!?!? Shouldn’t we get at least a more nuetral moderator?? I am not bashing on Obama, He definitely inspires hope to all people.

    One thing though, BIDEN has said MANY MISTAKES/(liesmaybe) and gotten away with it. Just like Clinton, he claimed to have dodged bullets in the middle east. There are videos to prove that wrong. He has gotten his facts/presidents/events wrong about the great depression era. He has made many blunders and yet look how clean he is portrayed by the press.
    Remember when Palin got bashed for the “Bush Doctrine”
    She in fact does know the bush doctrine. The STUPID reporter tried to trap her in asking what the bush doctrine was when in fact there are 4 doctrines!! She even asks him which one to talk about but the stupid ass tries to work his way around her question, ultimately making her look dumb.

    Again (*obviously) Presses such as NYT are in fact biased towards the Republican party. They have said that MCain has had an affair. Was that true?? NOPE. They make it a huge front cover story. What about when Edwards had his affairs. Did he make front page??? NOPEEE. NYT times said that IT WASNT WORTH MENTIONING…!!!!!!

    Now again MCAIN has his problems too. He is to vague. Hopefully the old man gets specific sometime soon. Palin now on the other hand is obscure in a non-harmful way. She comes on strong but Im not really sure yet…wellsee…

  • Denny Martin

    I hope this resonates loudly that Governor Palin is a winner! The press has been hammering with all they have and yet she has come through eloquently. There should be no more question. Sarah Palin is a force to be reckoned with.
    McCain/Palin=Winners!

  • EricF

    ok i said i was leaving but im back! Pony you are gushing naivity to say the least. first of all the only reason we are in an economic mess right now is because of the FAILED social engineering projects of the liberal agenda. political and social pressure was put on the banks to make loans to people who could never hope to pay off their mortgages. nice try tho attempting to pass the blame. if i could not think for myself i may have fallen for that hook, line and sinker just as you did.

    i guess Obamas economic plan could work if America was the only country on Earth but its not. Companies will flee America under Obamas plan and the ones that stay will be forced to raise prices to cover the tax increase. we will have less jobs and higher prices. good luck with that. those are the effects and they will doom America, but the whole concept of moving towards socialism is just as unamerican as it gets.

    also and sadly this website is slanted towards Obama as is the mainstream media. check the front page much? is Palin McCains messiah? how absurd. Obama is the one with the planted people at his rallys that mysteriously pass out. lol. yet you guys have the nerve to say Palin is a fake. just amazing.

    finally, McCain is not Bush and Obama is in no way Bill Clinton.

    almost forgot, we are winning the war despite the best efforts of liberals to ensure we lose and our soldiers come home in defeat. im sure you just like your homeboy Obama will try to steal credit for something you have nothing to do with. good luck with that also.

  • Rachel

    I am actually in complete shock over the people who are saying that Palin will be a breath of fresh air (and meaning it in a good way). Honestly, I don’t know about anyone else, but I prefer my air to not suck.

    For the people who are criticizing the critiques on her inability to speak — I really feel if you aren’t worried about her presentations of herself, then there is something wrong. If she is unable to command any respect from the American public, how the heck is she supposed to assist in leading this country? For McCain to consistently use his experience as one of his selling points and then pick potentially one of the least experienced people he possibly could have honestly seems like a contradiction of terms.

    Also, to whoever it was that posted about Palin being middle class and Biden being far from it — Sorry to say, but it seems like McCain is pretty well off himself. So, if you want to critique based on money, it seems fairly invalid.

    And telling people that they probably don’t believe in God? Not even a little okay.

    I understand the people who are voting for McCain mostly based on the fact of wanting to maintain more conservative ideals. I do not understand, however, the people who actually support McCain, or even worse, Palin.

  • Steele

    Wow! Palin can memorize talking points. Very Impressive! She couldn’t even answer which newspaper she reads. “All of them” huh? Or 1 single supreme court decision that she disagrees with. Well let me make a suggestion Dred Scott v Sanford ? You republicans wanna get some minority voters you have to at least admit that you disagree with that ruling! And why is Obama having such a hard time with these jokers. Their campaign is a facade. McCain is worth over 150 million dollars! He owns what 7,8 houses and 13 cars! But yet Obama is an Elitist? Yea Right McCain. Obama needs to put a monocle and a top hat on McCain and expose him as the “Monopoly Man” he really is.

  • Ekarderif

    1. She is not going to be president, John Sidney McCain will be and so he especially would lead in a 9/11 moment.

    You do know that the main role of the VP is to stand in in the event that the president becomes unfit to lead? If McCain were to die in office (which isn’t unlikely), then Palin WOULD be president.

    2. There is no need to bring in *od save us, that is just a stupid thing to say. I for one do not believe you to have a real faith in God and therefore see your comment about God as something you speech but never practice. To be a real person who believes in God you need to follow Gods teachings and that is something YOU definitely do not do and the only real candidate who does is Sarah Palin.

    LOL. I see this as you conceding the point, because I’ve never seen anyone else try to use “You’re not religious, therefore I am right and you are wrong” as a valid argument. Next time, try answering the actual point being made rather than focusing on one tiny and irrelevant detail.

    Oh, and just because Palin is religious does NOT mean she is instantly qualified to be President.

    EDIT: Obama is the one with the planted people at his rallys that mysteriously pass out. lol. yet you guys have the nerve to say Palin is a fake.

    So you’re making a totally baseless assumption, and using that to refute a claim that has strong evidence to back it up? I’ve lost count of Palin’s lies, and I don’t even live in America. That stuff makes the news here.

  • Jim819

    Speaking of Idiots,

    BO is the Idiot who stated that Iran is a tiny country which poses no threat to the US!

    BO is the Idiot who Proposed a solution to the Russia-Georgia crisis which the Russians can simply veto!

    BO is the Idiot who stated that he would sit down with Irrational terrorists without preconditions! And I don`t care how what former secs. of state, etc., say it`s ok. They`re talking about only at a high level and not the President! Kissinger pointed this out last week.

    I could go on and on!

    Also, Palin proved tonight that those earlier interviews were loaded with gotcha questions and edited to make her look bad!

    Btw, Palin looked no more scripted than BO did in his debate with McCain.

    She may be a heartbeat away but BO is the heartbeat!!

  • Ekarderif

    No more scripted? She was READING OFF THE SHEETS at one point.

  • dirtydurst

    I’ll give you a fact check. How are giving tax breaks to people making over $250,000 a year going to help “middle-class” Americans? That’s reverse logic Governor Pailn. 90% of small business owners don’t make that in a year, so they won’t see a tax break either. So you ask, who is winning in this situation then? Well big businesses and the top 10% in America, that’s who. Obama’s plan gives those small business owners a tax break, but increases taxes on businesses making over that much money. If you are making over $250,000 a year do you really need help from the government financially?

    It also sounds like Sarah Palin wants to get the “feds out of the people’s way!”. Well that’s great, less deregulation as both her and McCain support! But wait… isn’t that what Bush supported as well? And wait, isn’t that policy what lead us into our current ECONOMIC CRISIS? I don’t understand how you can want a narrow minded tool like McCain, then “Maverick” who has RARELY gone against his party when nothing is really on the line.

  • Chinchilla

    Bottom line if McCain kicks the bucket as men in their 70’s tend to do, I sure as hell don’t want Sara Palin making the decisions as my President! We need a world leader and she doesn’t strike me as being that….

  • EricF

    good luck with that tax refund, you sure will need it when everything doubles in price. i guess thats too hard for libs to understand. lol. on the brightside we will all be billionaires like in Zimbabwe… 🙂

  • EricF

    dirtydurst i know this will be very difficult for you to understand but i will attempt to explain…

    everything trickles down no matter if you want to believe it or not. if you raise the tax on business owners, they inturn raise the price on products and services so their profits are not reduced. these are the business’ that choose to stay in America. many will flee to other countries in favor of lower taxes so this means less jobs for Americans. so there will be less jobs and higher prices, dont worry though… you will get a tax refund so that makes it ok. lol. come on guys this isnt rocket science, its basic economics. stop letting yourselves be mislead.

    i understand alot of blacks are excited about the prospect of a halfblack president but dont let color be the deciding factor for the future of America. do the research and learn to think for yourself.

  • Margaret Grubbs

    Nothing but facts people. You have to admit, all through the debate, Sarah caught Biden, in several and detrimental lies. She also demonstrated consideration, respect and maturity to Biden and also pointed out the fact that they both concur on a lot of issues. She was nothing but polite to him. All parties should at least give her respect for that!

  • JD

    EricF – “everything trickles down no matter if you want to believe it or not.”

    You need to do you homework. Economics is not one direction with it flowing from the top down. Have you ever heard of Supply and demand?

    Supply = Business
    Demand = Middle class

    This is a classic case of which came first the chicken, or the egg. With out a strong middle class then there can be no Business. With out businesses there can be no Middle class.

    It is a balancing act. Take your trickly down theory and and stick it up your…

  • courtney

    Sarah Palin is incredible…Biden did nothing but attack the Bush admin. Why cant he state any of his own stands? Oh thats right…because he keeps changing his mind on what those stands are. I though Palin did an excellent job of letting America know what her plans are. Obama and Biden try to tell us what they think we “want” to hear. I dont think they have any intentions of actually making any GOOD changes.

    Im scared of what would happen if Obama won…America really needs to think about this decision! Its the biggest one of our lives!

  • Claire

    Biden seemed more authentic and personal.
    I have always felt he’s been there for the middle class.
    Palin kept winking at the camera and acting like a beauty queen who memorized the info she needed to win the Scholarship.
    She was acting like Bush did in his debates… remember those America?
    He did the gee-shucks, small-town-guy-thing too.
    She didn’t flub around like she has before this debate… I’ll give her that.
    But she’s also been sheltered from the media and coached and quizzed the last few weeks.
    I don’t like the republican policies or their deflect – avoid subjects – toot the America horn when I don’t like the question – style.
    That’s why I’m voting for Obama.

  • EricF

    Okay i have to say something.

    “i understand alot of blacks are excited about the prospect of a halfblack president but dont let color be the deciding factor for the future of America. do the research and learn to think for yourself. ”

    Yes and we understand a lot of whites are not excited about the prospects of a black man being president. Even if he shares the same views. So don’t play the damn race card in this discussion. Looks like we know what motivates YOU to vote against Obama so there really is no sense in anyone listening to your advise. You would only be convinced if he was replaced with a white person.

  • EricF

    JD, please tell me what you think companies will do if their taxes are raised. do you think they will say “oh well, guess we will take a loss on that.”

    be realistic about this. of course they are going to raise prices or find a new place to do business.

    do you think Obama is going to break out his magical wand and make companies stay in the US or not raise prices?

    how much of this inflation do you think some measley tax refund is going to cover? think about it. this plan is a net loss for the people. sure it sounds good but try to see the reality of it. im sure everyone here would like to be a billionaire but what happens when your billion dollar bill only buys you a roll of toilet paper?

    anyway im not here to argue but to try to enlighten the people here that are falling for this load of nonsense. if you want to debate this thats fine but lets keep it civil ok?

  • Babs

    O.S. wrote this

    “And hey voodoofire Obama is Osama not the one or the messiah.”

    And look at what EricF wrote. This is just an example of the point I try to make in why i make a lot of my rebuttals here. Those were out of line comments and no McCAin supporter will ever say anything to them for making posts like this. Now if i make a comment on it that translates into me attacking?

  • EricF

    Dreadsen i didnt say anything wrong. what do you think im a racist? well im not. hell im not even voting in this election, i made that decision when Ron Paul pulled out. he was the real best choice for president. you can call it the race card if you want but i think about 90% of black people that vote for Obama will do so because he is halfblack and havent even serioulsy considered the issues. for the record however i would support a black man or woman if that person was the best choice. Obama simply isnt the best choice here. dont let me decide for you though, my intention is to make people really look at the issues and not take everything you hear from Obama at face value. do your own research and apply your own thought.

  • Margaret Grubbs

    You know what upsets me? The fact that everybody blames Bush and his administration for all the problems we as Americans are facing today. A drop of a dime, oops Bush did it. There are other people and parties involved here. If you want to blame anyone, blame congres in general. I have seen the debates that go on and on in their, especially when Hillary Clinton was up to speak. I’m sorry but, first of all what a mouth! All that yepping. Come on, I know we have issues but man, hearing her speak, over-extending her minutes, and annoying the many tape recorders in the room, has anyone noticed that? I am so very dissappointed with the lack of attendance on the floor. Gees, Talk about lazy. They have a lot of nerve talking trash to Bush. Especially when it came to the stock market falling, he had to make the hasty decision he did, I mean somebody had to wake their sorry keasters up! HELLO!!

  • Levi

    Eric F,

    If you havent noticed this “low tax for everyone” mentality isnt working, especially when governement spending has increased 53% since 2001, according to a report I saw on the Sean Hannity show on FOX. We simply spend more than we take in. If you spend more than you take in you will run into some trouble agreed? When this happens we incur massive debts leaving us to even borrow from China to operate our government. Does that feel good to think about? No. Under this administration and under a future McCain administration the same strategy concerning taxes will be applied. Now giving you this line of logic, do you understand the implications of having tax cuts for all when we are in need of greater government revenue, especially in a war and various other conflicts across the globe? I hope this doesnt fall on deaf ears but please refrain from logical fallacies as you have sadly made in your previous posts. If you want to say something, great, but do so in a way that shows that you are versed and capable of eloquence and thought. Do not badger other people unecessary as it will do nothing to prove your points.

  • Joy2xs

    My fellow Americans:

    Interesting views, comments and biases it appears.
    There’s homework here if u wanna read and learn stuff.

    There’s so much to say, & less time to type it accordingly to cover all that’s as commonly interesting to me & to all other Americans.

    The bullying contortions by J.M. against Obama should be deeply considered and scrutinized. People repeatedly and commonly speak of being tired of lying politicians being in our governments, since I was a child that reached understanding.

    We have 2 “in-the-know” Senators team who are better emboldened of the governmental situation, rather than one very old Senator that never ever cared to run for the office of Presidency before now, and may stroke out or quickly die of natural causes, even before he might be sworn in as President, IF the possibility occurred that J.M WERE ever elected, which I hope to doubt occurring, are we, then, suddenly become governed by the newly elected Vice-President Sarah Palin magically as the new President, who tonight, clearly exhibited inexperience and lack of knowledge and information, especially where Joe Biden made crystal-clear earlier tonight, without even saying it, just proved she absolutely lacks true leadership on well-established infrastructure in international policies?

    Sarah Palin shuddered. She stammered. She smirked. She smile during serious issues she did not understand. She stuttered. She attempted to somehow mesmerized innocently intending to mentally prostitute the people with her country-imaged nature of silky jargon, as if Palin herself existed as some average run-of-the-mill person of silky charms.

    Beauty pageant charms and theatrics are not what are required to be used in a debate for the office of any vice-president which may need be the President very shortly after election and oath being administered. Short-sightedness improperly used will exasperate our people as a nation.

    Sarah delusions herself as amply ready to run the country as a vice-president. What a high-polished spin to lip-gloss over in her compact mirror! What IF J.M. strokes out?

    Is Palin truly QUALIFIED for the level of politics when our country is at its all-time worst?

    This is J.M.’s well-thought strategy to just keep the Republican Party in the Executive Branch???

    Palin was coached to simply refuse to answer direct questions, just like a beauty pageant, as if they were insignificant psycho-babble? She role-played this happy persona as if all is good she was chosen as a vice president running mate and then continually mean-mouth Obama and then she down-sized significance of issues queried on, and continued the J.M strategy to speak condescending attacks about Obama. Oh, and steadily smiling like she was the best snitch at a gangster party?

    Give Sarah Palin YOUR Emmy, Jerry Springer!!!

    Why would any reasonable normal person vote for any known political liar and support more condescending lies? Or simply, who would dare vote for an unknown lip-glossing comic-relief political entertainer?

    Commonly, typical ordinary people normally shun a liar immediately from their own normal everyday life.

    I possess the very real answer to the oil crisis at many levels, which has been used as strategies of political propaganda creating a common fear for the unlearned and ignorant people of our country.

    Obama states we could find a solution within 10 years to correct the power issues of oil dependency.

    I could give him all the numerous answers that would instantly correct the ailments of our country and especially in politics, if only, he simply asked me today to hear me out for 2 hours, and save the wait of another day upon being elected to the Presidency. No Joke!

    Why all the billion-dollar piece-meal patches to the economy?

    Why would anyone not even think that Bush has not already organized leaders of the world against Obama, using J.M as the Republican catalyst?

    IF J.M. won, will those same leaders still profit from Bush’s set-up’s of their independent financial prosperities? Especially when threats were made against the U.S. if we did not keep a short war?

    Talks were kept private. Threats never carried out. Bush sells out our country and our Constitution. It is what it is. Yet, nobody, no, not one individual notices, much less, slings out a single syllable to question these matters.

    Why has perpetual electricity been ignored?
    Because. It would devastate both the oilfield and electricity economies. It would rid electric bills for everyone in the world, if it were to be allowed.

    The notion of electricity being free, causing no pollution, making no noise, being transportable ruins the greed of governmental waging crafts to win politically using scare tactics, ruins the opportunity to skim money and privileges unseen and unaccounted for…

    That notion makes oil dependency drop in value, like dirt falling out of one’s hand. Turning a combustion engine into a simple starter scares politicians.

    Politician hurt the world, not the ordinary people. Such an invention stamps out starvation in the impoverished nation globally.

    Vision is what we need in leadership.

    Not rose-colored glasses, glib double-talk, smoke-and-mirrors, dog-and-pony-show politics, smiles, kisses, handshakes, all simply hinging upon warped psycho-babble b.s. pretzel-logic spoofs and yarns to give off sticky nuances of something warm, fuzzy or touchy-feeling to melt like cotton candy and simply do nothing good, once all the fluff melts!

    2 Senators are better than one. We need real change in Politics, not change in our pockets.

    Be glad I did not begin on what our Constitution already protects, like not being able to create men above the law because they work the government, that the U.S. Supreme Court unconstitutionally made illegal law in 1896.

    The 2 title of nobility prohibition clauses were the original 14th Amendment.

    See Federalist # 39.We are termed a republic, with no form of aristocracy monarchy ever allowed to be used in our governments.

    (Yet is was allowed into our government in 1896 Spalding vs. Vilas, as a rule of the courts in Britain, that form of privilege being finally destroyed along with those courts equally following Henry VIII’s death, and abolish in 1890 in England, that our Supreme Court “kings” resurrected and now have maintained to legislate law from the Judiciary. This wellspring runs deep.)

    See Marbury vs. Madison (1803)(no man is above the law; if a public servant violate his duty, he is liable to indictment, if a judge violate his oath has committed a crime, we are a country of laws and not of men[nobility is the understanding of that day meaning a noble privileged class or individual cannot rule the government])

    See United States vs. Lee (1872)(no man no matter how high an office he acquires in our government is above the law)

    See Sir William Blackstone’s COMMENTARIES ON THE LAWS OF ENGLAND (1765-69) vol I-IV

    I am Joy 2 XS and I approve this comment. Two damn hours.

  • Margaret Grubbs

    You know, I recall in the past two elections, were nothing but empty trash talk on both sides, never once an stimulating, intellectual discussion between to candidates, and the media circus…please bring us back to the days of George Washington when people spoke eloquently and what they spoke made good common sense, and the media kept their distance and their stories fact, not senseless!!! good grief I know I’m over it, how about all of you??

  • Frank

    What a dumb, useless debate.

    NO tough questions
    (what about poverty, healthcare? is it okay to bomb nations? why does Palin want to teach creationism?)
    NO follow up questions
    NO intelligent answers

    All they did was try not to say anything that would hurt the their running mate. The never answered a question and just kept talking about how the middle class is important blablabla.

    Nobody won this debate.

  • Britain

    Be warned, this is going to be a lengthy rant…

    As far as they economy is concerned, happier middle-class = Happier economy. Businesses will not “flee” America because of higher taxes. America, for most businesses, is the source of the largest chunk of their revenues, and if they leave, they simply won’t get any of it (unless they’re internet-based). If taxes remain on the working class, all businesses in America will have a hard time surviving in America if 98% of the people (working class) have a hard time buying their goods. People making 250K+ can afford higher taxes, and in fact since most of them are business owners, they will probably benefit from a population more able to purchase or invest. Inflation will happen no matter what…the price of everything has been going up almost double each decade no matter who was in office.
    And why are people so afraid for the business’s wellbeing when quite a few of them are outsourcing our jobs anyway in a time when they DO have the tax breaks?

    BTW, history lesson, the stock market crashed in 1929 mainly because of the fact that there was a lack of regulation on the way borrowed or lent money was handled. Sounds a little similar now, eh? I’ve heard of banks and people alike falsifying incomes to approve loans that can never be paid back. Lack of regulation on banks and lending institutions=High Risk. We should know better by now. Deregulation on those who handle the people’s money is not a very good idea, not back in the 1920’s, and not in the last 8 years.

    Last thing on economy. There are many for pushing economical capitalism. There are some wanting a more socialistic economy (Without saying the big bad “s” word). I’m interested in seeing someone able to bring some balance in government. This country could never be a true free market economy because without regulations and with complete corporate freedom, greedy and/or corrupt people and institutions would destroy America’s economy. True socialism could never be either because too many freedoms would be lost…freedoms in which our society and country were based upon. Someone has to find a common ground. Just like this country is not a true political democracy, nor a true republic…it’s a well-balanced combination of the two. Based on what they’ve already done, I think Obama has a better resolve in doing this. If McCain continues promoting deregulation like he has and the Bush administration, it’ll throw us into a dangerous free market where only the few will be well-off and most of us will be struggling and destitute. Too much of either, capitalism or socialism, is a bad thing for society.

    Newsflash, politicians lie. All of them. Bush is a liar (in the worst way), Clinton was a liar, Reagan was a liar…nothing new. I have not heard of one single politician that has told the complete truth 100% of the time (and at least survive in the political world). The government lies to keep the people complacent, the media lies to make a good story. Like I said, nothing new. So, “Obama/Biden = nothing but lies” is an illogical statement. I could say the same about McCain and Palin and be stupid too. Both tickets have lied about something, somewhere, at sometime during this election campaign. I look at what they’ve both lied about and how that affects their campaign and goals. Looking over both, McCain has a more contradicting track record to me. Like Biden said, he’s not really a maverick where it counts the most.

    Besides, the idea of Palin as President = Scary. I prefer to have a VP (and it is very possible for her to become president) that can think on their toes, that gives some evidence of thought before speaking (Bush doesn’t do that well either), and in this debate and her interview with Katie Couric, her wheels just don’t turn fast enough. If she even mentions the word “maverick” one more time in any response, I will lose my mind, because she uses that rehearsed crap when she can’t think of anything better to say about McCain. If she can’t handle Katie Couric’s or any other interviewer’s questions on issues, what makes you think she can handle questions well in diplomatic, foreign talks? Obama is the devil because he can form coherent statements? Please, I would rather have someone who actually sounds intelligent and is easy to understand to represent us as our leader in the world than someone who sounds like a complete moron. Gives us credibility. At least Biden can answer the questions he’s asked BEFORE (keyword: before) he goes off into some other-worldly rant. Palin rarely ever gives a concise answer to a direct question. She completely ignored the basic form of a debate…which is: answer the question, and then explicate the answer. Even when she did answer, the answer was vague, and her explication went off into left field. I can’t honestly vote for a vice president that messes simple things like answering a debate question. On top of everything else, I think McCain made a mistake having her on his ticket, because it’s just not her time yet. Palin’s thought process isn’t in that arena yet. There were many that were much more qualified.

  • susan

    Biden looks like Cat in the Hat.

  • Country First

    I cannot stand how everyone is SO critical when it comes to Palin yet Obama “can do no wrong”(Though he does a lot). Obama has so many things against him. From his lack of real experience to his indecisive votes (i.e. “present”), to his ties with radical extremist… people are so fooled by the words spoken from him. Guess what…politicians lie! The fruit (actions) of the person is what matters. Check the TRUE history of the two. Would you rather have someone with a radical, indecisive, and inexperienced background or someone with a loyal, honest, EXPERIENCED background? Obama promises change but what kind of CHANGE. Not all is good.

  • Marc

    Both Presidential candidates have an enormous challenge ahead of them. The present administration has weakened our country and damaged our nation’s interests, both domestically and with foreign relations in mind. This is a time to unite as Americans to regroup and implement policies which stabilize our current situation and give us hope for the future. I expect both parties to send final candidates who can do that. I am neither a Democrat nor Republican, however I must say that if Republicans want the respect of all Americans, then it should be understood that voters are not that comfortable with the idea of Palin running the country. We have all seen what the lack of experience can bring us. Not all rise up to the challenge and it is extremely hard to say if Palin could. I am unwilling as an American to take that type of chance. As much as some will want to bash me, it remains to be a huge gamble.

  • Michael

    EricF– both Biden and Palin was found saying things that were not accuate.

    See: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/debate_fact_check

  • Babs

    Joy2xs, I stopped reading your comment after this:

    “We have 2 “in-the-know” Senators team who are better emboldened of the governmental situation, rather than one very old Senator that never ever cared to run for the office of Presidency before now, and may stroke out or quickly die of natural causes, even before he might be sworn in as President”

    If you don’t even know that McCain has run for President before, the rest of your comment is less than credible.

    I see again, a lot of first time folks made the rounds of comment boards last night. Would be interesting to run the IPs and see how many IDs all belong to one poor, bitter, Obama supporter saying the same thing over and over. You know – that no substance slam that Palin has no substance. I even see some anger from some that Palin didn’t fall on her face.

    The commenter that said wait for the fact check on the debate is correct. Most pundits are counting a minimum of 10 “misstatements” from Biden last night. I’m not sure there were that many, some he just repeated more than once.

    What Palin did to make her the winner last night was to spit in the face of the MSM and liberal bloggers who have painted her as a piece of fluff, bad mother, etc., etc., all of which will still spew venom at her this morning in an effort to minimize the damage she did to the Obama/Biden platform last night.

    She was dead on to confront Biden on his own attacks on Obama, and I respect Biden for not trying to lie his way out of those.

    I do agree with the poster who said “I ain’t never going to change” is not a good thing for the “candidate of change” to say, especially so forcefully.

    Check and mate. Sarah won.

  • TimM

    I can’t understand how anyone can say Palin did well. She used the same answer to answer over three quarters of the questions. She couldn’t answer many of the questions so she “went back” to repeating herself. She spent how long being trained on what to say in the debate? It painfully showed. She showed herself to be a puppet last night and nothing more. When she can actually answer all the questions put to her, like Biden did, then I will say she may be ready to be VP, until then all she is is a gimmick that McCain hopes will get him and his failed policies into office.

  • dharm

    It was a wonderful performance by Joe Biden and though i liked certain points from Sarah Palin regarding Middle-east policy, her winking reflects she is not really serious for the internationally responsible role.

  • Pats

    Many people are lamenting about Obama’s tax proposal. Some even tried to explain the economic effects of tax increase in business but fell short. Tax is not the sole determinant of the establishment and relocation of a business. Among the factors are labour, accessibility/location, political stability, competition and market. Business people do not decide to relocate because of one ill factor when the others are favorable.
    Americans are very hardworking people, so the labour aspect is not ab issue. America is a first world state with all the network of communication which means accessibility is not a problem. The playing field is even for competition and the country is populous that market is not a question. Therefore raising taxes but maintaining political stability and making more friends with the world, will not only retain the businesses already there but attract more investors.
    My suggestion is, be not afraid of tax increase but study the other factors at play before you criticise. Fear of the unknown could be fatal. You are better economists than most of the world.

  • EricF

    nobody said tax rates are the one and only factor but it is a major factor. i even said companies would stay, however they will be forced to raise prices. you cant argue that they wont raise prices. a company will always pass new costs of business along to the consumer. this is fact and you cant even begin to try to dispute that. it is your lack of understanding that can be fatal, in fact it is that very lack of understanding that Obama/Biden are counting on. they are exploiting you and you are defending them with a smile. a $1,000 dollar tax refund wont even come close to covering the hyperinflation we will see.

  • IndiMinded

    Gotta love the people who complain that one candidate (the one they hate) was all lies in a debate, and love the opposition. Then of course these people look at the fact checks and say “ah ha! Biden DID lie!” completely forgetting to read all about the other half of the story.

    So which of them really told more fibs last night? Factcheck.org just might help with that http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/factchecking_biden-palin_debate.html

  • EricF

    That was debunked long time ago man.
    have you looked that 90% of blacks have voted democratic anyway over the past 20 years? There was no black person on the ticket then.

    “i understand alot of blacks are excited about the prospect of a halfblack president but dont let color be the deciding factor for the future of America. do the research and learn to think for yourself. ”

    How do you know that people who support him here are black? Being that you do not know it has nothing to do with this.
    So why did you bring it up?

    “Obama simply isnt the best choice here. dont let me decide for you though, my intention is to make people really look at the issues and not take everything you hear from Obama at face value. do your own research and apply your own thought. ”

    Do you realize your same argument also applies to some McCain supporters? Some people on both sides actually are supporting their candidates based on the issues and their platform. And some are devout to their party and are not rational.
    If you were a REAL Ron Paul supporter you would not just hammer one candidate and not the other one. He always points out what is wrong with both candidates. Which you are only focusing on one.

  • EricF

    Dreadsen, McCain isnt the one proposing an economic plan that will destroy this country.

    as i said before, i am not voting. however i would like to see anyone here make the case for Obama…

    times yours.

  • JD

    Babs,

    There is no way to know how the independents are swayed until a week or so later and by then there will be another Presidential Debate so a week after that…

    We might as well say we don’t know until election day. My Personal feelings are that she spoke and reunited the McCain base but I don’t believe she pulled in the independents. This is not a statement of facts since, as I said before, we can not know until we cast our ballets.

    I, again, did not like that she just flat out ignored questions. I really wanted a moderator to call her out on that but I understand that Ifill had some heavy pressures so I think she aired on the side of caution.

    Like I said… she dodged a bullet.

    EricF –

    Grab a book on economics and read it cover to cover. Preferably a text book from a university or a high school and not a pop-up book. Then come back here and talk about economics. Your lame brain one directional economic scheme is what is wrong with our economy.

    Jobs have been going overseas for 8 years now and their taxes are cheaper than ever. I would love to hear you explain the current phenomenon of jobs heading overseas?

    I’ll give you a hint… something to do with cost of labor and nothing to do with Tax…

  • EricF

    JD i have already said tax rates arent the only factor. certainly however raising tax rates isnt going to keep jobs here. also you completely ignore the fact that prices will rise on literally everything. nice how you have selective reading though.

    anyway my challenge to anyone here is to make the case for Obama…

    times yours

    [edit] and let me just say that i am not a stubborn person at all. i can be swayed if i see evidence that makes me reconsider my position, so convince me.

  • EricF

    thanks for ducking everything else i asked you but i’ll move on…

    McCain is the one proposing the Foreign Policy plan which RON PAUL is totally against. Look at the economics of THAT. You don’t think that will destroy the economy? And Ron Paul has said that OBAMA is better on Foreign Policy than McCain. Ron Paul’s problem was not with Obama’s foreign Policy but that he believes ( which i believe to) that Obama’s foreign policy would lead to less spending over seas but then he would just spend the money somewhere else. Which doesn’t address the spending problem.
    Ron Paul has endorsed Chuck Baldwin. You should look at what Chuck Baldwin has proposed and promote that instead of trying to make something good out of nothing.

    You are the one who is attacking on Economy so you should provide the initial argument of why McCain’s economic plan is better and any economist will tell you that taxes is not the BIGGEST factor. Have you looked at what the taxes were during the largest growth period of our history? It drarfs the taxes which are being paid now. But back then we didn’t have NAFTA and other factors which make it more desirable to go over seas. I dont’ care if you gave them a 1% tax their profits in a 3rd world country will still be gigantic in comparison. Actually a real economist will tell you that none of the candidates or their supporters know what they are talking about or have the slightest clue when it comes to economy. Economist have also said that BOTH OBAMA AND MCCAIN WILL ADD TO THE DEFECIT. So this argument is the equivalent to two blind people arguing about how the world looks.

  • Kathy

    After listening to this debate, I now believe two things:

    1. BOTH VP candidates have more personality than either Presidential candidate and

    2. The public can relate to them both more than they can relate to either Presidential candidate

    GO SARAH! Great job!

  • EricF

    Dreadsen can we get back to reality now? there are only two candidates with a chance at winning so that is what we are discussing.

    why is McCains economic plan better? because he would cut spending and lower taxes for companies and that would keep jobs here. also this would keep prices on products and services at a stable level.

    am i a McCain supporter? nope but if i had to choose on the issues McCain wins hands down. he made Obama look foolish at the first debate.

    anyway, am waiting for someone to make the case for Obama. 🙂

  • JD

    EricF –

    You didn’t read the book did you. I told you not to respond until you have some understanding of the economy.

    I had this conversation with another fellow and he sounded just like you. Goes by the name of Bill. You are Bill are you? Just signing in as EricF…??

    Lets do a little economy 101 for you.

    Tax = Cost
    Raw material = Cost
    Labor = Cost
    Transportation = Cost
    manufacturing = cost
    Time to Market = Cost
    Market Demand = effects price
    ….

    I’ll put all the clues together for you because I know you are scratching your head right now. All these things are costs.

    So do you suggesting that the US government gives labor away for free so that way jobs won’t go overseas (and price of product doesn’t go up)?

    Or mandate free transportation so we can get products to market faster and jobs don’t go overseas (and price of product doesn’t go up)?

    Or what about free Raw Material so the price of a product doesn’t go up and the jobs head overseas?

    You see, Tax is not the main cost of a business, in fact, it is not the determining factor in most companies until they are no longer profitable and then they complain that the taxes are putting them out of business and they ask for government bailout. When in fact they are no longer making profits.

    Now why would a company no longer be profitable…

    1. Labor is not available
    2. shortage on materials
    3. Transportation costs rise
    4. Market is not buying their product(Market pressure)
    5. list continues…

    The only company that is getting taxed out of business is the tobacco companies and that is another debate.

    But does Tax effect Cost? Yes, EricF, it does but in the grand scheme of things it is not why jobs go away and jobs go overseas. So unless you have a real argument and not just blind fear driven policy of tax causing jobs to go to other countries (Which they have been for quite some time) please do not bring up economy again.

  • Okay the first debate you are standing alone and are blind to say he made obama look foolish. This shows me what glasses you are looking at things.
    Back to reality I am. That is why i point out that YOUR candidate supports one of the remaining candidates foreign policy.

    Dude you have a cracker jack approach to economy. You still think lower taxes keep jobs here. When taxes much higher in the past didn’t drive them away. If this is what you call making the case of McCain then there is no discussion. You are stuck on debunked argument.
    Why present the case for Obama’s being better if both of them are bad? That is trying to trick someone into presenting something as being better when they may in fact feel both are bad but are bad in different ways.

    Chuck Baldwin said it in Pennsylvania.

    Obama = tax and spend

    Mccain = Borrow and spend.

    Which is more reckless?

    CNN: Fact checking McCain’s alleged “cutting spending”

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7YRsyW34I4

  • Babs

    Actually, JD, there’s a point to be made that higher taxes DO cause jobs to go overseas, and it’s made by economists everyday. The US has one of the highest corporate taxes in the world, and it drives businesses away from American and overseas. That’s why it’s an asinine proposal for Obama to want to raise corporate taxes. Perhaps you should do a little more studying before stating otherwise.

  • EricF

    JD you are a typical liberal moron. arent prices high enough already on everything? you even admit prices will rise but cant make the connection to what this will do to the American economy. you are one of the people that will have to see to believe, i hope it doesnt come to that. i think you dont understand the concept of inflation and how it can destroy an economy. the Obama plan is a net loss for the people anyway you want to look at it. a tax refund will not cover the rising prices on… everything! your money will be worth a whole lot less and before you know it we will all be billionaires, only a billion dollars will be worth next to nothing. good luck with that.

  • EricF

    Dreadsen, McCain has already announced a spending freeze for his first year in office if elected. get your info right or i will have to start calling you joe biden. lol.

  • Freezing is not CUTTING. And once he unfreezes you are back at the same spending.

    Let me also point out that the LOOPHOLES is the devil in the details when it comes to the tax rates.

    This link debunks the taxes on corporation argument.

    http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2008/08/the-greek-menac.html

    Some responses to the Tax Foundation’s announcement of a new campaign called Compete USA which claims high corporate tax rates are hurting US competitiveness. First, Paul Krugman:

    http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2008/08/statutory-versu.html

    “But it’s not clear why he would post a graph showing statutory rather than effective tax rates, and why he would post a graph that combines the data in a way that just happens to exaggerate differences between the US and other countries. As Paul Krugman says:

    The Tax Foundation is not a reliable source

    and he links to this evidence detailing why the graph is misleading. As he explains:

    What they don’t make clear is that:

    1. The graph shows the “statutory” tax rate, which is the maximum rate a corporation can pay in principle. But because corporate tax rules allow all kinds of deductions and exclusions, the statutory rate is a poor guide to the actual disincentives the corporate tax creates.

    2. Even more important, while they don’t explain how they calculate the “average” tax rate, the fact that their own data show that all the big economies have tax rates above 30%, while their graph shows an average rate of about 27%, seems to indicated that they’re showing us an unweighted average — that is, one that makes small economies like Ireland and Greece seem as important as big economies like Japan and Germany. And whaddya know, corporate taxes in big economies tend to be similar to those in the United States, a point made by the Congressional Budget Office in the study from which the chart above is drawn. (Yes Germany cut rates this year. Big deal.)

    And, as Linda Beale notes:

    [T]he US is actually a corporate tax haven, with the lowest effective corporate tax rates of almost all the countries that participate in the OECD. That’s a little fact that the Tax Foundation apparently doesn’t want the American public to understand, since all its hype is in terms of statutory rates and not in terms of effective tax rates.”

  • JD

    Babs,

    I swear you and EricF are stealing Bill’s lines.

    I like you, Babs, but you are wrong!!!

    You confuse how our corporate tax system works and assume it is a simple tax system. It is not a clear cut system and in fact companies often deduct for capital expenditures. Please tell me I don’t have to explain what capital expendituers are and how it effects corporate Tax.

    “Tax rates around the world vary considerably both in their statutory rates, and in their effective rates after all offsets are considered, preventing any straightforward comparisons of tax rates between countries”

    So it is impossible to say and verify that United States has the highest corporate tax because of all the deductions and subsidies given to the companies and their ability to hide income as a capital expenditure.

    For example US Companies making over 18 million are around 35% but with incomes around 50,000 the tax is cut to about 15%… in the UK it is around 30% at the U.S. top equivalent which is less then the U.S. by around 5% but when you look at the lower margin, I.E. small businesses, the rate in the UK is 21%. So it would seem the US is much more friendly to the Small business market.

    Again, it is difficult to see what the companies are really charged because of all the tax write offs. The US offers some of the best write offs for a company and the ability for a company to change how they report profits using the MACRS system.

    Read more about the MACRS here.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MACRS

    Like I said before your argument that corporate tax is the deciding factor on why companies move overseas is null. Companies who are formed in the United States or
    conducts a trade or business in the United States are subject to corporate tax so it doesn’t matter if they are in another country. They are still taxed.

    The reason why they move overseas has to do directly with the labor rates. I speak this from personal experience. For every person hired in the US 10 people can be hired in China. With the loose trade agreements we have in place it is makes it difficult for the labor in the US to compete in the low income nations.

  • John J

    Why are we in this financial crisis? Looks like it is because of deregulation. Who are the big fans of government getting out of the private sector? The Republicans, John McCain. Now, I know some Democrats are complicit either by design, or lack of effort, in letting deregulation get out of control. But, it is the Republicans who’ve been preaching laissez-faire economics for the past 20 years. In the past, perhaps John McCain did actually support some additional regulation of the private sector. However, it appears to me that when he decided to run for President, he flip-flopped on a lot of issues he used to be a “maverick” on.

    Like, torture. A man who has had personal experience of it, used to be opposed to it. But now, well, “only the CIA can use it.” Or, anyone else they designate, I’d bet.
    “Obama/Biden = lies?”

    Sure. “Iraq is an international threat, they’ve got weapons of mass destruction. They’re sponsors of terrorism.” Well, they weren’t sponsors of Al Qaeda, until that moron W. decided to rip apart their government and let the country go to heck. We had a country that was, at the time, largely in favor of our being there, Afghanistan, the actual base of Osama, mostly under our control, and then we had to go off to Iraq and W’s personal quest, or his group’s grab for control of their oil. And, McCain wants to continue this war? We want to reward the Republicans for putting W into office, by electing someone who’s basically been a yes man for this administration the whole past year.

    Everything trickles down. No, some of it trickles down, apparently just enough so that the average American’s wages can remain stagnant over the decade, while the great majority of the wealth generated, just gets concentrated in the hands of the people who are controlling it. Well, if the Congress does it right, they could get some of that back now, getting some interest on the money they are loaning to the private sector.

    We’re just blindly accepting the Democrats’ message. Sounds to me like you just swallowed Reagan’s voodoo economics, hook, line, and sinker.

    Finally, vote for a man who will sit down and talk to a nation’s leader, no preconditions? Darn straight, I’d take that any day over a President who wants to perform a preemptive strike. Throughout the Muslim world, we are now perceived as the bad guys, and we are giving the moderates little reason to think otherwise. If we could elect a President who isn’t on a personal “Crusade” against the “Axis of Evil”, I think that could do nothing but help.

  • Dale

    Babs it’s clear you’re a well educated Repulican and although I rarely comment myself I often read yours and I’m often impressed with your insight.

    However, even as much as you might want it to be so, there is no way on earth Palin won that debate, I doubt even Fox News will have the gall to try and report that. This debate was a whitewash.

    Palin certainly finished a lot stronger than she started. There are quite a few facts, especially in terms of de-regulation that are, unfortunately for every Rebuplican, completely undefendable. The age-old Republican philosophy of a completely free market economy with no regulation has been de-bunked. As somebody who studied economics at University I often had interesting discussions with my lecturers about the validity of a completely deregulated market, and certainly the US economy has gotten closer and closer to that since George Bush reached office.

    Well I guess I got my answer, and so should every Republican. The verdict is in, complete de-regulation is really bad. People with too much power who focus in on short-term gains with too little regard for the long terms effects simply can, and sometimes will, without correct regulation, cripple the market.

    Palin, quite simply didn’t even bother trying to answer any detailed question to this effect which was astoundingly obvious and really showed her weaknesses.

    I was kind of surprised that Biden was as controlled as he was given his performances in some of the earlier Democratic debates. It was obvious at the start as Palin simply refused to answer questions that Biden almost seemed like he was wondering why she even deserved to be on the same stage. Her inability to answer a direct question was laughable.

    Certainly to her credit Palin finished a lot stronger than she started, especcially as she began to answer direct questions she came closer to holding her own although still, it was clear she’s not in the same league as Biden.

    The Democrats just simply have better policies this time. Oh and Babs, Biden’s comment about change you and another poster zeroed in on, was about his personal approach, not his policies, and not how he forms policies. While I agree it’s not the best thing he could have said, you’ve certainly skewed the context.

  • Babs

    1) I never said they were THE highest.

    2) I never said it was “the deciding factor”.

    But you spin it good. You’re really Dreadsen in drag, aren’t you? 😉

  • Dale

    Babs it’s clear you’re a well educated Repulican and although I rarely comment myself I often read yours and I’m often impressed with your insight.

    However, even as much as you might want it to be so, there is no way on earth Palin won that debate, I doubt even Fox News will have the gall to try and report that. This debate was a whitewash.

    Palin certainly finished a lot stronger than she started. There are quite a few facts, especially in terms of de-regulation that are, unfortunately for every Rebuplican, completely undefendable. The age-old Republican philosophy of a completely free market economy with no regulation has been de-bunked. As somebody who studied economics at University I often had interesting discussions with my lecturers about the validity of a completely deregulated market, and certainly the US economy has gotten closer and closer to that since George Bush reached office.

    Well I guess I got my answer, and so should every Republican. The verdict is in, complete de-regulation is really bad. People with too much power who focus in on short-term gains with too little regard for the long terms effects simply can, and sometimes will, without correct regulation, cripple the market.

    Palin, quite simply didn’t even bother trying to answer any detailed question to this effect which was astoundingly obvious and really showed her weaknesses.

    I was kind of surprised that Biden was as controlled as he was given his performances in some of the earlier Democratic debates. It was obvious at the start as Palin simply refused to answer questions that Biden almost seemed like he was wondering why she even deserved to be on the same stage. Her inability to answer a direct question was laughable.

    Certainly to her credit Palin finished a lot stronger than she started, especcially as she began to answer direct questions she came closer to holding her own although still, it was clear she’s not in the same league as Biden.

    The Democrats just simply have better policies this time. Oh and Babs, Biden’s comment about change you zeroed in on, was about his personal approach, not his policies, and not how he forms policies. While I agree it’s not the best thing he could have said, you’ve certainly skewed the context.

  • JD

    EricF,

    Can you read of do we need to turn this site into a pop-up book format?

    Your only argument is that you don’t agree. Wow. thanks for contributing. You call me a “liberal moron” but lets look who it is coming from…

    A Ron Paul Poser.

    You are bleeding red from every pore. If you don’t understand something than you should just say so but talking for the sake of talking is not the solution.

    It just exposes the douche you are and does nothing for your image as a poser.

    Let me guess… you disagree with me. Big surprise but you are still a douche and no amount of cologne is going to make you smell any better.

  • Dale

    This could really use the gentle caress of a quality web designer

  • JD

    Babs – “You’re really Dreadsen in drag, aren’t you?”

    I’ll be what ever you want… Whatcha doin’ tonight?

    Lets role play. 😉

  • EricF

    ok JD lets follow this hypothetical situation out. lets say Obama wins and we do get the tax increase for arguments sake. you already admit prices will rise. with those rising prices sales will drop. agree or disagree? lets say you agree. as sales drop companies will go out of business or will be threatened to go out of business. agree or disagree? again lets say you agree. what will these companies then do? oh. what will the employees of said companies do? oh.

    sounds like a plan to me! lets get the ball rolling. or should i get working on that popup book for you?

  • EricF

    JD can we get a response or are you browsing wiki again looking for something to copy and paste? lol

    also in case you guys dont know, Ron Paul is a republican

  • I watched the debate and thought that both candidates did fairly well. McCain was not my first choice, but he is now my only choice. I feel better about voting for McCain because of Palin. I guess the democratic slobber of the week will be “Palin didn’t really answer any questions!” You must have watched a different debate than the one I saw. I thought she did a great job of answering the questions. I have heard democrats saying that Palin is the “scariest” candidate they have ever seen. I think this fear is actually intimidation. That’s why our liberal media is working overtime to try to harm her in any way they can. It’s the Clinton technique all over again; just keep lying over and over until people start to believe you.

  • BluePlanet

    Sarah Palin seems nice enough a person to watch my kids, but my country ? No, thanks !

  • JD

    EricF,

    No thanks, you can keep you pop-ups. So Obama is going to raise the corporate tax. Do you know to what percentage?

    Now Compare it to where it was when Reagan was president.

    Did we have jobs in the US going out of business because of how much Reagan was taxing for corporate tax?

    Again, you view this entire thing as a linear system and that is fine. You are not educated and fall back on the 30 second sound bites from the news and your blanket\stereotypes of the economy and the black population.

    EricF, Just because you feel like something is true doesn’t make it all true or even true at all. Especially, when you can not back any of what you are saying with details, examples, or references.

    So lets start with your question on Raising the Corporate Tax back to where it was under Reagan.

    There is do doubt that a tax can cause the price of a product to increase but the confusion is that tax is a cost. Any cost can raise price and most costs are hidden to the customer.

    Do you know the cost of silicon that goes in the semi-conductor?

    I could argue that because you do not know this than it is a hidden cost that is passed down to the customer. Again, Tax is a cost.

    Now let us go into why cost is necessary. Taxation is a cost to everyone. It is a way for us all to pay our fair share or rather the cost of doing business in a particular country.

  • undecided

    I’m from a small town/middle class and she doesn’t appeal to me with that talk, we don’t all talk like that, or expect our leaders to talk like that (“you betcha, darn right”) and worse, the wink-it’s insulting. It is also quite scary that McCain/Palin call for giving the tax credit for people to deal with the HMOs that have criminally taken advantage of the middle class with their marginal health care plans. I don’t want the government to leave me alone with them, I guarantee you only one of us will “thrive” and it won’t be the American people. I wish we could have heard what the Nader/Gonzalez ticket had to say about these issues, I’m tired of this 2 party system!

  • EricF

    @Dale

    we are in this mess because banks were pressured into making high risk loans. they were threatened with the magic word… racism! this has nothing to do with deregulation. it has everything to do with the race card. someone had to say it.

  • EricF

    JD you cant make a logical comparison to when Reagan was president since the entire world market structure has changed so much since then. nice try though.

  • EricF

    “Again, you view this entire thing as a linear system and that is fine. You are not educated and fall back on the 30 second sound bites from the news and your blanketstereotypes of the economy and the black population.”

    oh ok i see the game you want to play. you cant defeat my logic so im a racist? amazing. im done with this website. have fun pulling the race card everytime someone proves you wrong. thats the way to be.

  • JD

    EricF,

    I didn’t call you racist… I said you stereotype. Funny that your mind went there though. Actually, you are kind of like a little child that confuses a bunny rabit with a mouse because both are furry.

    I see you are suspending your campaign here. I guess you are a McCain follower.

    Still, do you notice that all you do is desagree and basically ask others to come up with all the information?

    An idiot can disagree(you get an A+ there). Lets hear your arguement? So the economy was different under Reagan… How so?

    Is it so different that the priciples can’t be applied?

    Why do you think jobs are going overseas currently and over 156,000 jobs were lost this last month? Is it because of our corporate tax?

    What sectors of our economy are suffering right now and in what ways?

    Lets start here.

  • Margaret Grubbs

    Listen, everyone.. We all have a voice!! We need to obtain signatures to get rid of the IRS and replace it with a federal sales tax, and also get rid of credit score ratings. Some businesses in particular are discriminating against Americans when they apply for a job, they base whether or not you are allowed to work for their company based on our credit scores, which is degrading and demeaning to those who are desperate for a job and have bill collectors at the door.
    Please tell me how all of you feel on the subject. 🙂

  • Frank

    Babs said,

    “Check and mate. Sarah won”

    How can she have won when she didnt answer the questions?

    Im dissapointed at Bidens lack of balls. He could easily attack her on many issues but he didnt.

    Again, this debate was pathetic

  • freedomwriter

    reading off the scripts?
    stop bashing & put yourself in the situation.
    this is a huge debate. why would you go unprepared?
    anyone in their right mind has potential responses laid out.
    i am a writer & know this to be true.
    if you have EVER led ANYTHING you know that having notes is essential.
    ANYONE is wise to seek the advice of others to construct thoughtful responses and have them available. but i guess you have never led anything to know.

  • Kevin

    McCain/Palin = nothing but lies

  • Babs

    freedonwriter, I agree. What I saw was Sarah constantly taking notes as Biden spoke, and refer back to them in her rebuttals – a totally normal occurance in debates. I saw Obama do the same thing last week almost to the point that I thought he was using it as a ploy to be rude.

    Kevin, you’re such an intellectual. I beg you, tell me more.

    Frank, which did you prefer? Palin not answering a question (Biden did the same), or answering the question with mistatements that make you look foolish – as was the case with Biden. You see, Frank, if you KNEW more about the facts, you would have caught this. Since you don’t, you didn’t, and so you can’t understand why Palin won.

  • Will

    It’s saddening to hear so much praise of Palin’s performance when all she managed to do was to avoid major gaffe’s. Somebody said the moderator was slightly harsher towards Palin…well how about the fact that Palin is just a softy to begin with?

    Palin dodged a major bullet, she was lucky Biden was going after McCain and not her. Had he done so, he would easily corner her. She talked in circles and was way too folksy. I can’t imagine her speaking to foreign leaders using phrases such as “hecka”, “betcha”. Not to mention winking to the cameras.

    I hope the American people are smarter than this. Unfortunately a few posters here aren’t and are in much denial.

  • Babs

    And a few posters here could say you’re in denial, Will. What you call “folksy”, I call personality, along with a regional accent. I don’t know where you come from, but all regions have their own idioms, slang, and accent. Hers is Alaskan. If you think it’s strong, try a New Jersey or Mobile, Alabama one. I’ve always said I speak two languages – the one I speak in the office, and the one I speak on the back porch with my elders – who don’t care what you think of their “folksy” talking. This is where the “breath of fresh air” comes in with Palin, and she uses it well. Much has been said in the past about Obama’s “accent” depending on where he is and who he’s talking to. So I consider applying this as a negative to Palin as a double standard.

    I’m sorry we make you sad. You should have winked back at her, it would have made you feel better. 😉

  • cory

    I would like to point out a key overlooked point on the economy. Poor people spend all the money they have every cent, many middle class as well. They just have larger monthly paychecks.

    More money from tax cuts in there pockets, means more money immediately stimulating the economy. Thus increasing corporate profits. Stimulating product releases, wider market niches and thus more jobs to create, market, sell and produce more things.

    I am in the field of product design, the design firm branch I worked at was closed shortly after Bush was elected, my jobs since have yet to equal the pay I was receiving then. No more year end bonuses for employees.

    The company I worked for is still around, they just are not releasing any new products to a weak economy. I am sure they are making tons off the ideas and work of the people no longer employed for them. Marketing of old ideas is the only area they spend money.

    Every industry is different, yet from where I stand, quality of life is perceptibly better for the American people who can afford to purchase things to enhance their life.

    We as a country are the largest open continental economy in the world, corporations make more introducing products and services here then anywhere else no matter the tax rate. We will not see a loss of corporations if they do not get as many tax write offs. We may see a huge gain in our economy, job prospects and the daily lives of 95% of our population under an Obama Biden ticket.

  • JD

    lol. That wink was cheesey though. You have to admit babs.

    I was thinking about this today, Babs, Do you think Palin’s poo stinks? Or does she just deficate flowers?

    The debate was not a desisive victory for either candidate. I think they both did the job at making a case for the top of the ticket. So it is hard pressed to say which one was the winner and an arguement can be made both ways.

    If I had to say what annoyed me about both was Biden’s big sighs and Palin’s Maverick word.

    Babs, I bet you an I would be a blast if we could hang out on your back porch. We could mix some Vodka with some ensure and have a hell of a time! 😉

    You cougar… Meow!

  • RD

    This debate was a “wash”. Palin did better than expected, and Biden spoke less, but when he did, he was strong. There were no clear winners–although Palin did prove herself capable and a formidable opponent despite the media’s nastiness. She deserves credit for that.

    But overall, I don’t think it will affect the outcome. People have decided at this point.

  • EricF

    “we are in this mess because banks were pressured into making high risk loans. they were threatened with the magic word… racism! this has nothing to do with deregulation. it has everything to do with the race card. someone had to say it. ”

    Stop with the debunked talking points. Blaming this on Jimmy Carter’s time in office when they passed a law so you could not discriminate against QUALIFIED MINORITIES. You hear that? Qualified minorities. Meaning that there was a practice where if you had two people. One White person and one minority. Both of them as far as credit are identical but the minority doesn’t get loan because of the color of their skin.

    Now i know you must champion discrimination and feel that if they still had the power to discriminate that we wouldn’t be in this situation. It’s just that simple blame it on the minority. I guess predatory lending couldn’t happen because it was only being done to minorities and if they were blocked from getting loans this wouldn’t happen. Those adjustable rate mortgages where someone is paying 800 a month then it shoots up to 1600 a month never would have been a problem if we would have kept those black people from being able to get a loan in the first place.

    By the way Ron Paul is a libertarian in a Republican outfit. When he first ran for president he ran as a libertarian but the only exposure he got was on Morton Downy Jr. Show. He had to join a major party in order to get his message out. His principles and platform are not even close to the neo con party disguised as the old republican party.

  • Jared

    After watching the VP debate, what I was struck by (other than the obvious difference in quality of the VP candidates) was how Governor Palin tried to portray herself as the everyday average person, as the soccer mom. Whether she is or not I will leave for you to decide. What worries me about this is what seems to be a trend in US elections. The candidates, who can best portray him or herself as the average person, are the ones who get elected. George W. Bush is a prime example.

    What I think everyone should ask themselves is, do I want the everyday average person leading us? Or, do I want the exceptional, the best and the brightest?

    Personally, I want the people I see as my superiors, the exceptional, the best and the brightest leading me. I’ll leave it up to you to decide for yourself who the exceptional the, best and the brightest are.

  • Marc

    First of all, I want to point out that I am a Republican. A Republican according to our parties original ideals and value system. I am ashamed to read the comments in this thread that make Mr. Obama and Mr. Biden sound like liars above all. These comments sound like they are coming from children who have lost all respect and have absolutely no intellect. Both parties suffer from too many lies and both need much reform. The people here that are claiming that Senator Biden is just lying are in most cases completely factually wrong and I would dare say borderline idiots. Are you trying to tell me that Senator McCain and Palin are being truthful. Do you not read and realize that sadly, McCain’s campaign has really suffered because he has chosen some of the same smear tactics as did Rove/Bush, when they destroyed him in the Republican race in 98-99. By people writing such stupid comments here, they are doing the same thing that they are accusing the candidates of. Let’s have a real debate. Discuss real issues. Remind us as a nation that we have more in common with each other than conflicts. The voters of neither party are interested in having a liar in the White House, so let’s not smear just because because that’s seemingly ok today. I have a lot of respect for John McCain and I have the same for Senator Obama and Senator Biden. They are all good politicians and have friends on both sides. It is absolutely disgusting to hear people degrading candidates just because of party favoritism. We are either all going to get there together and/or not at all, so start thinking and discussing and stop insulting and promoting the lying that is actually going on.

  • Marc

    AMEN!! thankyou very much!

    Babs

    you think your funny eh? Saying JD is me in drag! lol

    But i think you don’t realize that a lot of my talk is in defense. And i point out all the time how both of these guys are the same and their real differences are ignored.

  • Ironman

    I think Palin did well on domestic and financial issues.
    She came across strong and confident in those areas,.. she didnt have to reference notes and she spoke directly to Biden looking him straight in the eye.

    No one so far in either debate has done any better.

    Biden is a a good speaker,..Although Palin was more credible on domestic affairs, it was clear Biden had the upper hand on foreign issues.

    I would not write her off as Presidential material. I said before,.. and firmly believe, she may well suprise alot of people.

    She shows without a doubt her ability to grasp the concepts, and initiate favorable solutions to economic and domestic issues.
    These matters seem instinctual to her.

    If she was President now, and 911 happened again today,.. She could only rely on her advisors, the American people and prayer to make the right decision,.. huh, now that I said it, that actually doesnt sound that bad. lol.

    She’s Intelligent and level headed. She’s a quick study. She is undeniably in favor of middle class America, less goverment spending, and her record proves it.

    My hope is the McCain Palin ticket wins,.. Palin gets foreign affairs experience at the best level she can (VP)
    and runs for President in 2012.

  • Ironman

    BTW,..

    I read above where someone was saying something about wanting the best instead of the average.

    I’m not trying to be provoking,.. but I dare say few if any on this forum have what it takes.

    Identifying with Average folks because you’ve been, or still are there doesnt mean you cant think outside the box.

  • Kevin

    Palin is full of it. She answered few questions that was asked. The fact is if she goes in office we will get just another 8 years. We need real change, Washington needs to be reformed. We need a person in office that is for the people by the people and of the people. Neither of these two are that change but McCain and Palin is not any where near that change. At least Obama has a plan to start that change. The fact is the McCain is old school and is not up-to-date on anything.

  • Babs

    Another 8 years, Kevin? So you think they’ll be re-elected in 2012? Interesting.

    Dreadsen, EricF has a point. Take a hard look at ACORN, they were one of the groups that pressured (breaking into banker’s offices, going to their homes, etc) banks into making bad loans. It’s been proven to be a part of the present problem.

  • Pats

    Can someone tell me how a government will reduce tax and reduce spending?

  • Babs

    That is not the motive behind Eric’s point. Look at some of his other posts where he threw race in the mix.

    These guys are blaming it on a bill during the Carter Administration.
    But i would like to see this proof that Acorn breaking into bankers offices and forcing them to make bad loans is what lead us to this problem. I mean Wind is part of our energy production. It actually is. But if you see the pie chart of our energy and see the role which wind plays you would agree that if it was removed we wouldn’t even notice the change.

    I think this theory of what ever Acorn was supposed to have done holds about as much responsibility for the problem as Wind is to energy production Right now just a way for people who probably don’t like minorities anyway to channel their anger at them.

  • Margaret Grubbs

    Ok people, This comes down human nature. We argue, then fight, then we have casualties, it’s a vicious and very sad cycle. Because people, in general, only hear what or who they want to hear, so we constantly deal with irrational behavior that is easily spread by those who can and the media does not help!! Now here’s the part to laugh at…That is why we can’t have one without the other otherwise there would be no DEBATE LOL, and yes I agree that an independent candidate should be involved in all debates just to be fair. and no, I’m not Independent, I’m a Republican!! just deal with it!!

  • savanna

    Obama is very different, raised Muslim (radical at times) went to a fake Christian church that had Farikcan and all kind of cazies as mentors. Who in their right mind would attend a nut case church like that for over 20 yrs. and subject their own children to this “hate white” mentality? The Chicago machine put him where he is. All you voters out there had better think long and hard before you vote. I don’t believe a word that man says

  • ed read

    Âfter watching this sort of VP debate and all the opinions in this forum plus the latest polls, it is inevitable to conclude that:

    Palin is falling and McShame too.

  • ed read

    Congratulations to most of you guys !

    Consciousness is on the rise !

    After watching that sort of limited debate, reading your comments and looking at the latest polls it is inevitable to conclude that:

    Palin is falling and McShame too.

  • Margaret Grubbs

    Mccain will win because he has the backbone to face terrorist threats. Obama has not proven to me once that he will be able to handle the pressure of eminent war threats thrown his way. He is not ready yet! I want to feel confident in a candidate when I back them. I feel more strength in Mccain than the other. It is just my view. 🙂

    Peace!! 🙂

  • Ironman

    Frankly I’m shocked the Republicans have faired as well as they have.

    The public scrutiny of the Bush administration reached open protest for impeachment.

    I didnt agree with alot of things that he did.
    But I think it fair to point something out, thats been very overlooked since the Republicans are affraid to even mention his name. No matter how big the blunders he made, he did recognize, and tried very hard to fix the fannie mae crisis in 2003,.. thats 5 years ago folks!
    He tried to make a radical reform to that system,..

    But it was not the republicans who shot it down. One of the chief opponets was Barney Frank.

    Make no mistake,.. I’m not saying Bush didnt screw up our economy,.. I’m saying niether he nor the republican party are responsible for the colapse of the lending institutions.

    If you believe anything else you havnt done your homework.

    Obama, and Biden have both mentioned that they “warned” or “could see” the comming crisis,..
    Regardless of how you feel about Bush or McCain,.. they both actually “tried” very hard to do something about it, and it was not their own party that stopped them.
    Those facts are undeniable.

    Obama was involved with lawsuits against Citi bank because they didnt want to make high risk loans,..
    The guilt by association thing seems to plague him.
    Do some leg work and find out who Reins is, and what his relation to Obama is.

    Lots of people have emotional responses regarding the canidate of choice. When I see folks here attacking either side with contempt or slandorous remarks, I think to myself,.. that is the part of the population that votes uneducated,.. they blindly see an Ideal and go with it.

    That was me,.. I voted for both Carter and clinton,..

    I really didnt understand anything about how it really works,.. my decision was strickty emotional,.. I believed both were kind hearted people who would do the best they could for the people.

    Although Carters CRA program wasnt really hurting us, Clintons “change” was the nail in the coffin.

    In the Current election I’m voting to the right for a number of reasons.

    Regardless of how it turns out,.. I hope Palin gets the nessasary experience in foreign affairs, and comes back strong in 2012.
    I have allways been traditionally somewhat of a sexist, (nice legs Sarah, but not in the white house) but after seeing her speak with the conviction she has, combined with her record, I’d like to see her there.

    Some folks here have stooped to some pretty low levels with statemnts about here intelligence.

    News flash for all those rocket scientist,.. it would be pretty difficult to achieve the things this person has if they were “clueless”
    Dont you imagine it takes a little bit of savvy to to be a mayor of even the smallest town,.. or moreover the govenor?

    My favorite is “I can see Russia from my house”
    The insinuation is over the heads of a few I’m sure.

    Consider for a moment the difference between living 5,000 miles away,.. or 30 minutes away from one of the most powerful nations on earth that isnt exactly your buddy.
    It doesnt give you any foreign experience whatsoever,.. what it would give you is a strong sense of just how real, threats to security could be.
    Dont you imagine that everyday conversation in that region would have more reference to their nieghbor with speculation and fears more often adressed than would be from folks no where near such?
    Does that give you insight into foreign affairs?
    Obviously not,.. but what it does give you is a lot of first hand experience with the American people, and their take.

    I was going to toss a bit of sarcasm,.. well I did a little but I’ll keep it clean.

    Most folks who take narrow views are less likely to expand that view if attacked.

    Most of all,.. whatever you do,.. PLEASE, dont vote an emotional ticket,.. do the homework,.. be preparred to accept that the guys or gal that you want to support arnt everything you thought they were.

    Ok I’ve run on long enough.

  • keith

    I am a poor young student and this is my first time i have ever been signed up to vote. Personally, I would like to vote for the canditate that wants to put efforts towards education. This seems to me like the only rout towards sucess in the long run. People seem to be arguing a lot about the tax plans, and trying to give each other economics lessons. This is how I see it in my own mind (never have taken econ. mind you). Lets say someone makes $300,000 a year, they get taxed an extra 10%. (that is way more than Obama is proposing, right?) Then at the end of the year, they would have $270,000. That is a lot of money! Someone tell me why a buisness that does that good would have to charge more for their product? My dad just started his own buisness a couple of years ago, he’s struggling because middle class people don’t have much money to spend right now. If they got a tax break they could spend more, and if my dad got a tax break,(because he is not making anythin close to six figures) HE would be able to buy the things he wants and needs. Is this flawed? please respond, I dont give a damn if anyone tries to rip this idea to shreds, I’m here to learn.
    On Palin, all my teachers seem more educated than her. I am apalled that McCain picked her, she only seems to know about Alaska. I think all polititians need to have seen the world to be able to make decisions that will affect it.

  • Stalin

    Keith,

    Since you asked nicely, I won’t rip you, but please take an Econ class, it can only do you good in the long run. First off, someone that makes $300,000 is taxed at 33% federally, so you are left with $201,000. After you deduct sales tax, state tax, self employment tax, capital gains tax, etc. you are left with far less than that. To answer you question about why that is not good for a business, the answer is jobs. The less money that companies, especially small companies have the less employees they can hire. The higher the unemployment rate, the less people spend and the less people paying into the federal income tax system. If is a proven fact that the less tax you collect the greater the federal revenues are. Make sure to read that sentence again. It’s very important. You can tax rich people to hell, but in the end it won’t do anybody a damn bit of good.

    About Palin, what do you define as an education. I am more educated than Palin but I do not think that I’m smarter or more capable than her. Do you think PhD’s and lawyers are the only people who should hold office? Some of our greatest presidents came from humble backgrounds. Knowing Alaska is no small thing, so don’t maginalize that experience that she has. I hope I have helped and that you will consider your vote carefully.

  • Stalin

    What about the tax breaks? From what i hear the tax breaks is how they get around those taxes so they may only be paying 20% or less.
    Also what about in the 1950- 1970’s which was our biggest growth period. The rich were getting taxed 70 – 90%.
    What other factors contributed to such a large growth under such a high tax rate?

  • PeoplePower

    First off, a long-needed comment on EricF who seems to have a one-track mind that has no real basis in reality…and the comment is stolen from JD…LMFAO!! Thanks JD!

    JD to EricF:
    “Let me guess… you disagree with me. Big surprise but you are still a douche and no amount of cologne is going to make you smell any better.”

    I’m not usually a fan of personal attacks, but some people are in dire need of an enima, and EricF seems to be one of those people.

    At *least* the regulars on this site who support McCain largely come across with factual, rational arguments (even if I disagree with them).

    Make a point, be persuasive, reference some *facts*…maybe then, you’ll get some respect and a rational rebuttal…

  • Ironman

    Dreadsen,

    Could you please explain what you mean by “greatest growth”

    And didnt Kennedy lower the tax rate to the weathiest?

  • Ironman
  • Frank

    “Frank, which did you prefer? Palin not answering a question (Biden did the same), or answering the question with mistatements that make you look foolish – as was the case with Biden. You see, Frank, if you KNEW more about the facts, you would have caught this. Since you don’t, you didn’t, and so you can’t understand why Palin won”

    Explain to me Babs why, if i knew more about the facts, i would understand that Palin won.

    To me Palin is like the Iraq war. The bar for succes is somewhere 10 feet underground.
    Yeah, she didnt gave dumb answers, what a great performance!

  • Ironman

    So Frank,

    Are you saying Palin didnt effectively answer economic questions or clearly state her position even to the point of differing with McCain?

  • Frank

    Ironman,

    Yes im saying that. The only thing she (and Biden to) did, was talk about how she are gonna lower taxes for the middle class.

  • Dale

    EricF, perhaps that was because they were being uppity, yeah uppity

  • Dale

    EricF, perhaps that was because they were being uppity, yeah uppity.

  • Margaret Grubbs

    Hasn’t anyone noticed how the media has put Obama on a pedistile with a little glitz and glam on top? Sugar-coating a candidate to get them into office never works, nobody wants to see that, Americans want results. Are they capable of handling the issues of this position? How will they deal with every individual issue that is thrown at them? Will be able to deliver on their promises? We are all human. Of course it is not going to take 4 years, or maybe even 8 years, whomever gets in, but while they are President, they need to demonstrate the appropriate image, and for once, actually think about the American people, not their and administrations fat wallets. I just hope that the United States doesn’t completely become socialistic, because that is what I have begun to notice, especially with medical insurance,…Control!!! Being president is a hard job, and they can try, but, really, you just can’t please everybody. So, it’s like I said, it’s human nature pretty much. The never-ending vicious cycle… and it goes on, and on, and on, and on.

  • Frank

    Margaret Grubbs,

    You want results.
    So with two dumb wars, a few trillion deficits and an economy in ruins i take it you wont vote republican this year?

    And why do you care if your healthcare is run by the government or not? As long as you get it right?

    Would you rather have your government spent billions on useless wars or on the health of its civilians?

  • Wow this was good. Sarah was GOOD! She is a good persuader. But Joe got this!

  • jdashn

    No major country in the world is completely laissez faire (100%free market) and no major country is completely socialistic. While many contries lean to one end of the spectrum or other (Free market—USA — — Norway—socialism) When most people think of socialism they think Communisim, like cuba or China or the old Russia.
    Socalisim=/=Communisim.

    While some may believe that Not allowing our poor to die from hunger, or exposure to the elements, Keeping our work force healthy, educating our future leaders and workers, and ensureing that our middle class can afford the goods and services they need to survive and become upwardly mobile is… EVIL.. I’d certainly be the first to disagree. These “Socialist” policies are, at lest in my mind, needed to ensure the FUTURE of our country.

    Another thought. Tax brakes for wealthy vs tax breaks for poor.
    Now i’m talking individuals, not businesses.
    Those who are poor and middle class spend all of the money they make, plus incur quite a bit of debt. The VAST majority of this money is spent within the united states, purchasing goods and services that stimulate the economy in positive, growth forward ways.
    Those who are the Rich here in the united states, do not spend all of their money, much of their income goes to investments (which can be either positive for the econ here in the usa, or in times of USA financial difficulties, not so positive) or towards goods and services overseas. Much of the money stays in the pockets of the Rich.

    Which is more important for a business? Credit, or Sales? If we’re talking about the same amount of money, I’d most certainly wager Sales would be MUCH more desireable than Credit. Also, the more sales you have, the eaiser it is to aquire credit, no?

    As for taxes on businesses, I would certainly hope that a slight % increase in taxes could certainly be covered by the profit margin of many of the companies. The only businesses that’d have to worry are those who are in serious financial trouble already. Why should we worry about companies who’s only real concern is what they can “creatively” (IE lie) report at the quarter?

    Why do we have the financial crisis right now? Greed.
    I don’t blame the Republicans, or Democrats spesifically as they too were lied to. I blame the corporate heads who have allowed Creative Accounting, and Profits today, Tomorrow be Damned sorts of mentalities – That is what has TRULY created our current situation.

    Why were bad loans made? Because they were profitable!!!
    Loan officers (glorified car salesmen, who make a better % the bigger your intrest rate is, the less they explain, and quicker you sign the better!) made TONS of money. The Original lenders did too!! (most sold their bad loans off to larger companies before they started to go bad). Then again, I suppouse “socialistic” regulation could have helped there.

    out of our 44 presidents 4 died in office 4 were assinated and 1 resigned. Meaning 9 of 44 presidents were replaced (without election) by their vice presidents. That’s just about 1 out of 5 right? With those statics in mind would you still believe your candidates vice presidental choice was correct? Do you think he/she would make a good president in times of extreme difficulty (assination,resignation)? I for one cannot trust someone who looks like they will attempt to lead with a wink and a smile.

    If normal people were to act the way our country has lately in regards to foregin policy this might be an example of a conversation:

    Person1: Hi, I’d like to talk to you about my favorte color Green!

    Person2: I will not talk to you about Colors until you throw away all of your green shirts, buy red shirts, and ban people from thinking about Green shirts. Then we can start to discuss your favorite color Green, and why it’s not as good as red.

    Why can’t we act like normal rational humans and go about it like this:

    Person1: I want to talk about wiping israel from the map

    Person2: I disagree with you, and think your ideas are bordering on insanity, but if we can talk it out maybe we can find out where our diffrences lie, and maybe i can convince you to change your ideas. I not change my stance on providing aide to your country as long as you have these goals, but if you would like to talk, my door is open.

    Conversation leads to understanding, and sometimes change. Demands before converstaion leads to mistrust, anger, resentment, isolation, and the hardening of even crazy ideas.

    Drilling of additional oil resources here is stupid, and certainly NOT forward thinking. In our current oil market any oil brought to market goes on the world market – not straight to usa pumps. At these markets, the price is set, usually at the same prices as oil from other countries (OPEC Countries). If the price is significantly lower than OPEC prices, the OPEC countries will purchase it and resell it at the higher price or produce less oil raising the overall price of oil, Resulting in the same price for the oil as the current market demands. The only reason to drill for this oil NOW (as opposed to leaving this investment in the ground) is to enrich USA oil drilling companies. After a few years of drilling the oil will be gone – and not available for future generations who will need the oil for the production of plastics.

    I know this is a mish-mash of politics, econ, and personal belief – and says very little directly about either candidate for office. I do think though you can see the relationship to the issues in this election.

    J-n

  • Ironman

    Frank,

    Read the question again

    As far as palin being “effective” on answering economic questions,.. Her response wasnt concise and comprehensive,.. it was however a good general outline, and it was presented in a simplistic fashion. She definately got the point across,.. you yourself recognized it. So how effective was she?
    For the sake of argument lets say you didnt get the amount of detail you wanted to see.
    I’d give you that,.. but I wouldnt say she was ineffective.

    But no one can reasonably argue she was not “clear” on her stance. She is for Goverment regulation where its needed, she is for less goverment spending, fighting coruption, lowering taxes, and supporting education. She referenced her record to show what she believes, up to the point of differences she has with McCain.

    If you saw anything other than that,.. you should watch it again.

  • alex

    biden knew what he was doing and what the vice president does
    palin just mentioned the same thing over and over and over again
    she shouldn’t be running at all
    she is more of a gimmick than anything else
    i think mCcain is happy that she doesn’t have to be in anymore debates
    she reminds me of cheney
    scares me so much

  • Ironman

    Alex,

    I will be a staunch defender of Palin.

    She is very simplistic in her aproach. She gave her track record,.. had she chose to go into great detail about how she accomplished what she has done, (if time had allowed) it might sound a little different to you.
    Biden said the same thing over and over again as well.

    He simply presented it in a different way, and threw stats to sound impressive.

    It pays to look a little closer.

    Palin may be from a humble backgound, and not part of “the Washington crowd”,.. but that may well be her greatest strength.

    “playing politics” and knowing all the right people are not,.. Read that again, “are not” criteria to hold public office on any level,.. from small town mayor – to commander in chief.

    Some of our greatest Presidents came from humble beginings or had little experience,..and look at what they accomplished.

    Read about Teddy Roosevelt sometime.

    There is NOBODY running for office right now that has anything on her except years of political BS, that thank God she is without.

    Everybody has a gimmick,.. the Democrats have Obama,… 🙂

    Sorry for the jab,.. I just happen to believe in Palin

  • Dreadsen

    So Obama and Palin are just gimmicks now?

    The people chose Obama. So i guess you have 18 million fools.

    One fool chose Palin.

  • keith

    Jdash.
    thank you for your input and views that is exactly what i was trying to say. well put.
    yeah Palin was very simplistic in her approach, and i see how that caters to simplistic minds. but politics are a lot more complex, and she doesn’t seem to get the big picture.

  • Ironman

    Your makin my sides hurt,

    The people chose Obama?,.. I thought they chose Hilary,.. then there was some funny buisness and bango Obamas the democratic nominee.

    But hey what do I know,.. I have one of those “simplistic minds”,.. unlike the complex ones that eguate trying to establish talks with an insane crimminal who wants to commit genocide on the same par as talking about your favorite color. OMG.

    Heres another analogy that might be a little closer to the point.

    Lets say someone doesnt like keith,. in fact they hate keith,.. they want to kill his entire family, they want to burn his house to the ground with them in it.

    They go around publicly anouncing this,.. they tell the police they are going to do it and defy them to do anything about it. They start packing gas cans over to the side walk in front of keiths house. Now keiths neighbors dont exactly care for him either, so they arnt going to do anything to stop it. All wacko needs is another can of gas, and a book of matches. So there are two courses of action.

    1.The police try and setup a meeting with this insane little fellow who is hell bent on exterminating keith and his family. The police want to tell the wacko, their points of view, and how they dont think arson and murder are a good idea. they also want the wacko to know if he still insist on killing keith, they are going to have his employer cut his wages so it takes longer to buy more gas and matches. Further more they want the wacko to know if he ever feels like talking about it the door is open.
    How warm and fuzzy.

    Of course there is another option that seems to be the way things work in the real world.

    2. The police get a swat team and go after wacko, they dont really seem to be interested in negotiations and wacko takes a ride, vertical or not.

    Simple solution,… Most things work better that way,.. including “politics”. Alot of people like to make things more complicated than they need to be, for a lot of reasons,.. most are self serving.

    Not everyone can grasp the concept. Some come by it naturaly, as they lteraly are simplistic in nature,.. others must obtain “wisdom” to clearly see its benifit.

  • Ironman

    man that was a real knee slapper.

    if it was that simple then Colin Powell, Kissinger, Eisenhower,Ronald Regan, and i think 10 former secretary of states are fools. Especially Colin Powell. Chuck Hagel even said that McCain is smarter than this and he knows it. Remember you have to take the advise of other wise people on this issue.

    How about Kruchef when he stomped his foot and pointed at us saying he would bury all of us.

    What did we do?

    We invited him over for tea at our presidents house and he came. guess what. with no preconditions.

    World Politics is not as simple as a policeman answering a domestic call.

    And in case you haven’t noticed the Bush Administration has sent officials to talk with the Iranian president who doesn’t hold the power. Ahmadinejad can not authorize war, he can’t end war, he can’t stop the nuclear program or start it. If he isn’t low level i don’t know what is. Even if he was to agree to something he has to ASK people above him to grant it then from there i believe it goes to the AYATOLLAH. I know they probably don’t want to talk to that guy after what the united states did to them in the 50’s when they commited all those terrorist acts to put the Shah in power. But he is who runs it.

  • I work in politics professionally, and i’ve talked to 2,000+ Obama supporters and NOT ONE, NOT ONE can provide a convincing reason to vote for him beyond the empty rhetoric of his campaign – and i live in his base – the SF Bay Area.

    I understand everyone’s hatred of bush and the republican party, but, take it from someone who has been working 10 hours a day in politics ever since 911, the Democratic Party is full of MASSIVE MASSIVE LIES. Their entire platform is based on lies. Obama supported and voted with Bush on ALL of the important things that everyone hats about bush: No Child Left Behind, FISA, Patriot Act, Funding the Iraq War, and now, the biggest fraud of all time, the $700 bailout bill. No one has yet to explain how Obama is going to be better than bush. Higher taxes on business and capital? Even Obama admitted with George Stephanopolis that his own tax proposal would harm the economy. Don’t like the war, Obama isn’t going to stop it, he’s just going to move it to a different region.

    I’m writing a book, and making a movie about this, i’ve been researching this 12 hours a day the last 3 months, i suggest all of you who think Obama is going to save you wise up a bit and do your homework. Things are not nearly as simple as the appear. by the way, for some quick videos of Obama lying directly to the American People, Visit my website United States Liberty.com

    In short, i reject Obama entirely. Im smarter, younger, taller, better looking, got better grades, understand the economy far better, im only 32, but if i was older, i could run for president and kick this guys ass. One day i will.

    The biggest crooks often have the biggest smiles.

  • For everyone This is not meant to say one opinion is better than the other but just to show you what some Israeli Defense officials have said about talking with adversaries.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlPyapkDORQ

    They discuss our election over here. These are opinions from the people IN ISRAEL who are responsible for protecting Israel. So it holds some value.

  • Will

    “This is where the “breath of fresh air” comes in with Palin, and she uses it well. Much has been said in the past about Obama’s “accent” depending on where he is and who he’s talking to. So I consider applying this as a negative to Palin as a double standard.”

    What accent?? I’m not talking about accents, I’m talking about silly phrases and expressions she uses. If you’re going to sit there and say that it’s natural then don’t bother, we will have to agree to disagree. In essence, it makes her appear ditzy at best rather than carrying herself as a VP.

    And to ever lower the bar for any VP candidate is a sign that you don’t have faith in your own candidate, and it saddening if it suffices the American people

  • Ironman

    Dreadsen,

    I’m glad I was able to humor you.
    I’ve been entertained along the way myself.

    There is usualy more than one way to deal with things,..Although some matters are very complex,.. the simpler the solution the better.
    Often I use the analogy of clearing your property of thorns,.. they will never be gone until you take the root. You can dance around the real problem, spend time and money trying to contain it, but ultimately, you will have to take the root.

    Obama himself said, “He would do everything in his power,.. and he stressed the word ‘everything’ to stop Iran from obtaining nuclear weapons”.

    Strong language,.. the intent clear. I advocate the same.

    Perhaps the context of my statements you responded to was overlooked or misunderstood.

    I’m glad you brought up Regan,.. He refused to have negotiations, he stuck to his “guns” so to speak, and ended the cold war. Could you please direct me to the tea party with Kruchef, and how it influenced the cold war.

    I’m having difficulty finding anything substantial on that.

    The middle east crisis has been going on for thousands of years, Obama is not the first person with the aproach he suggest.
    History is a great teacher.

    “There is nothing new under the sun”.

    But of course thats “old school” and does’nt apply anymore,.. its probably too simplistic as well. 😉

    I did appreciate the video clip,.. It has inspired me to see how the current Israel Military views this issue,.. Retired generals may speak more openly, so I will most likely have to read between the lines a little, but we shall see.

  • Ironman

    Will,

    I believe the word accent is being used as a metaphore.

    You mention sad.

    The epitomy of which, is when we as Americans establish a standard to judge competance on appearance rather than performance.

    It pains me to think a scociety would embrace such concepts,..
    as they are the root of discrimination.
    Focus on character has great merit as well,.. but should not be confused with personality.

  • jesse

    All of you democrats out there slamming palin, can go hug your trees. Palin is indeed a breath of fresh air in the election. We should be grateful that McCain chose her as his running vice president. She will bring in the new and out with the old

  • keith

    very mature. you guys seem to be into that fresh air, why dont you and your maverick buddies go hug some trees and thank them for it?

  • Ironman

    lol,

    Mavericks and Change, I’m tired of them both,.. John didnt use his catch phrase tonight, and Barrak only used the change angle a couple of times.

  • Andrew

    I am 21, live in WI, own a home, have no college degree, and work 40 hours a week as a night billing clerk at a mid range paper company(If you have seen “The Office” I can tell you its close to being that ridiculous and funny in real life).

    I must say as far as this debate is concerned i understand peoples desire for the Palin fresh air. She comes across a little strong with the you betcha and wink business and i see how that bothers people. Overall, she did a fine job holding her own against an older more experienced opponent. However, I still feel its big jump from Gov. of Alaska to VP(possibly President) of the US. In 2012 if she is still around I will certainly enjoy seeing her run. As for right now is seems like a Disney Channel original movie(sorry Palin enthusiasts).

    As for Biden, he reminds me of most other politicians. He speaks fairly calm and clear and in my opinion did a good job in this debate.

    I have watched most speeches from both sides and seen all the debates so far. The one clear thing that emerges is that i hate political blather and banter and wish the candidates would answer the damn questions properly!

    O’brien/Weinberg 08

  • I noticed one big shift in Obama’s foreign policy which is quite interesting in view of his opposition to the Iraq War. One of the ongoing problems in Iraq was the continuing genocide against the Kurds. By Obama’s new doctrine as enunciated in this debate, he would be required to send American forces in to stop the genocide (since things like bombing and no-fly zones did’t seem to work well in preventing “collateral damage”, as Iraq showed.

    If we tie his actions to his words, genocide is ok in Iraq but not ok anywhere else. If the shift in his policy covers the entire world, then his opposition to Iraq is hollow pandering.

  • Ironman

    Andrew,

    I appreciate your “unbiased” lead in so you could make a Palin jab. It kinda reminds me of the SNL portrayal of Bidens take on McCain. he he he

    As far as Biden goes, I cant agree with you,.. He’s definately beyond average. He does share some of the same qualities attributed to the average politician, such as changing the subject and never answering the question. He does however possess another attribute that makes him “stand out” amongst the rank and file.

    Not willing to be out “kitchen tabled”, he played an emotional trump card.
    Although his display had nothing to do with the issue, (middle class Americans financial situation) It effectively clouded the issue, and shifted the focus from someone who really does understand middle class America,… to having empathy for someone who felt pain.
    Worked pretty good to take a realistic identification with a realistic problem, and make it an emotional issue that had nothing to do with the subject matter.

    I wasnt going to say anything about this, but perhaps its the only language some understand.

    Mr. Bidens tactic of using such tragic experience for political gain is disgusting. I lost all respect for the man at that point.

    “A disney movie” maybe so,.. is there a part in it for a snake, I see a perfect canidate.

    It amazes me that when faced with what may well be one of the most critical elections we will vote in our lifetime,. the thing that should be looked at the most,.. is looked at the least,.. the track record of the people we are voting on.

    Instead, it seems many of us like to watch the talking heads, and judge the canidates based on their personality,.. and who can effectively blow a better smoke screen.

    Several post ago, someone mentioned the “bar being lowered”,..
    Once you set the bar on “presentation” rather than “performance” the Arena now goes to the best “showman”.

    Sound like a place for lawyers?
    They’re allways honest, right?

  • Ironman

    I had to throw this in,

    Its just a fact about lawyers,. they will fight til the end usinging whatever tactic they can devise to win their case, often times ignoring the truth. And thats what we want them to do,.. thats what we pay them for.

    What sould be remembered is their loyalty is to the guy writting the check.

  • Andrew

    Dont worry! I dont base my decision on these debates but i greatly enjoy seeing how the “dogs” are trained to look and act on stage. Its like picking out a seeing eye dog for a blind person. Doesnt matter how good they look as long as they stop us before we walk into a busy intersection and keep us on the right path. Just my look on it haha

  • Lauren

    Palin, owned.

    Sorry Biden, you dug yourself into a hole.

  • Independent

    I am truly sorry if someone has already mentioned this, but Palin’s English language skills (or lack thereof) completely irritated me. “I’m gonna…”, “the economy is hurtin'”, “nuculer”, etc. Now, I will admit that Biden slipped up a couple of times, but no where near the slip-ups of Palin. A professional debate is no place for such uneducated-sounding language; I have had enough of it from George W. And for the last time, people, it is nuCLEAR, not nuCULER!

  • Ironman

    Independant,

    lol. jus cuz ya got noe edjucayshun, dont mean yer stoopit!

    Maybe they’re just hookt on foniks.

  • so over all of this….

    i’m tired of both major party candidates. mccain is a sellout and obama has backtracked one too many times. nothing is going to be different no matter who’s put in office, as the debates so far has made very clear. when are we going to have a real-deal, gloves-off, no-holds-barred debate where moderators do their jobs by following up w/ tough questions and not letting any of the candidates off easily? when will the candidates stop saying what they think what their constituents want to hear, and just speak what they think is the plain, hard truth of things? i could just as well write-in “donald & daisy duck” on my ballot as any of the other major tickets for pres and vp…aagh! sorry, just venting, just fed up :o)

  • mischievous dame

    mccain did ok but i think it could have been better. but if you want another 4 years of bull policies n lies stay at home because that’s some of what you’ll find n mccain. if your looking for a “real” change and your waiting for something to actually be done about all our problems–economy, gas, health care–then vote for someone we can all believe in. vote for a real economic change. vote for obama. BECAUSE WE CANT AFFORD ANOTHER 4 YEARS OF THE SAME.

  • I say debates are boring like no other… I only watch it for doing my stupid papers. But I like the Saturday Night Live version of this debate. It makes me laugh… =D WATCH IT! If you are a Palin/McCain fan, you might get offended because they totally BASH her the most!!! It’s SOOO FUNNY THOUGH!!!

  • I think Palin is not what America needs. The last thing we need is a woman who can’t lead a country. If you’re going to be the president you have to be a good strong leader. Sarah is not going to be able to do that, because she’s too friendly. You can be friends with the enemy!! Biden is more eldgible for the job as vice pres. because he’s a better leader.

  • Rooobz

    Watch This. We want her to take over when McCain dies?

  • matthew

    hey mccai n is fake he never will be a good president boohoo=] =]=]
    happy halloweem:p

  • naser

    hey there..im not an american and you may think that this election has nothing to do with me or my country..however, i strongly believe that mccain might be fake but he is the right man to be president at this time..why?
    i think its because america is a super power and is a leading country in the United Nations,so America is the worlds police..The WORLD needs a strong leader as president..this is because the world has been having more wars recently and whos better in war situations?? obama or mccain? Mccain is 72 years old he has been fighting for his country from the age of 17..he has the correct strategies for the war in Iraq and the future war in Iran..If Americans vote for obama (who i think should be president IF there were no wars america was in) then he wouldnt be able to lead america out of the war as a victor..for the situations going on in the world today mccain should be president..
    thanks..

  • Jenna

    I can’t even believe what I’m reading!

    I would like to bring this comment up once again, so that not a single person posting something should have the nerve to say something as stupid as this again.

    “She is not going to be president, John Sidney McCain will be and so he especially would lead in a 9/11 moment.”

    What if McCain can no longer be president???

    …and he’s old the chances are great.