January 11th, 2008Posted: 3:50 am by Nate
Here is the entire video of the 1/10/08 Republican debate from Myrtle Beach, South Carolina:
It was raucous and entertaining. Leave your comments here.
how the HELL is hukabee still even IN this race?? what a blubbering nimconpoop. i can see why the MSM wants him to win. sorry but it just astonishes me how he’s even still IN this thing! it’s frustrating, how some republicans actually voted for him ON PURPOSE! HOW’S IT POSSIBLE???
Can someone tell me if this is the edited debate that leaves out all of Ron Paul’s brilliance? I don’t think I can sit through the whole awful FOX bias/boring robotic rhetoric by the other “candidates” again to check.
Does it have Frank Luntz’s terribly scripted actors too? And his God-awful phony video charts?
PLEASE tell me it has Ron Paul’s 32% for the win poll at the end!
FREEDOM! RON PAUL 2008! America’s Only Hope
Fox News Republican Debate Winner South Carolina
Who won the ABC Republican Debate in South Carolina?
these republican candidates (excluding paul) are the least of the least. how can a normal human being throw so much mud on constitutional principles concerning guantanamo?! every criminal has the right to defend himself in a court, yes even 9/11 terrorists. excluding them from the right to a fair trial is violating fundemental human rights.
Mike Huckabee won the debate as usual. He is one of the most inspiring candidates for President that I have ever seen!!
Ron Paul won Fox’s text poll by 10 points but Fox hides that fact on their UNFAIR and OFFBALANCED web-site.
Thank you for posting all these debate videos! What a great resource.
Wow….where to start. Ron Paul supporters, obviously you missed the bumbling stumbling idiot he made of himself when we spoke on the Iran speedboat incident, the guy can’t even hear half the time. He’s clueless. I don’t understand the Ron Paul phenomenon but give it up, he isn’t getting anywhere near the support to make a run for the nomination. As for Guantanimo Bay, obviously you people don’t understand that by bringing these people to American soiil and putting them through our court system, they wouldn’t get a fair trial. They need to stay where they are and endure the trials they get there through military tribunals. They are prisoners of war, not law abiding American citizens. How do you know they aren’t gettin all thier rights to begin with? The media tell you otherwise or have you been there and interviewed them in person?
Question….How many Democrats can post about the Republican debate?
Don’t worry about our candidates, worry about yours.
You people are funny!!! This only applies for those Ron Paul supports WHO CAN READ… Click the link above that PollM provided in their comments. Do you see 5%. That is what Ron Paul currently has in South Carolina. I dont trust the same poll you see on the site, cause I work in IT and I know that there are simple ways to skew those numbers. I’ve done it for fun myself. Please do you candidate a favor – Pitch in and buy him a new hearing-aid.
I would just like to make this analogy refering to a comment that Mitt Romney made. The comment he made was this “we need to become very serious about moving the more moderate voices in the world of Islam to greater strength”….” ultimately we are going to have to move the world of Islam, because ultimately Muslems themselves are going to have to reject the extreme.” IS HE KIDDING? Does he actually believe we can move the Muslims to a level of consiousness wherein they will not be extremests or that we will actually be able to move enough of them to the belief that they should reject their extremist ways that have been prevelant for all mankind….when here in America we can not even move many of our simple minded citizens to “a greater strength” in believing that it should be okay for a man to marry another man. When we stop rejecting our own fellow men and women because of their sexuality, and stop discriminating against them becuase of it, maybe then we can move on to trying to get the Muslim world to reject their own extremests.
I have to agree with the Angry American, Ron Paul did make himself look bad a few times with his hearing problems. He also made himself look good with some very persuasive idealogies. I do like the fact that Ron Paul is one of the few candidates who stands on strong principles. I like that Mike Huckabee is a positive person, he stood up for himself cleanly and convincingly. John McCain also made insightful arguments. I don’t get Thompson, though. All he does is rip on the other candidates. I don’t know a thing about him except he’s a smart aleck and makes the Republican candidates look bad.
Hmm, let me begin by saying that I am not a Ron Paul supporter (though I totally respect the man – very polite and intelligent fiscal conservative who certainly sticks by his views with passion) and I usually don’t have much of a problem with Fox News (it’s my preferred media outlet for political news), but I was a little put off by the network excluding him from the New Hampshire debate the other day (without, to my knowledge, providing a reasonable explanation). Additionally, and I don’t know if you all noticed, but the moderators hammered Ron Paul because apparently some of his supporters (a small fraction) who call themselves “9/11 Truthers” believe our government was complicit with the attacks and covered up the truth about 9/11. The moderator not only asked Ron Paul if he was prepared to ask those supporters to abandon that kind of rhetoric, but in his inquiry, suggested that Ron Paul give those supporters the ULTIMATUM of ceasing their rhetoric OR divorcing themselves from his campaign. I mean c’mon. Ron Paul isn’t responsible for the radical views of some of his supporters. He spoke up about the 9/11 investigations, but you can’t blame him for what they believe. The moderators didnâ€™t suggest that any of the other candidates give their supporters ultimatums. Let’s be honest here. I’m sure that there are, for example, radical Huckabee supporters who are Anti-Semitics, radical Romney supporters who are polygamists, radical McCain supporters who want to bomb every non-Democratic country in this world â€“ but you canâ€™t discredit their followings because of those views. And Brit Hume? He is supposed to be an objective moderator, but when Ron Paul responded to the Iranian speed boat question (and was clearly addressing a war-mongering attitude), I sensed that he simply did not like Paulâ€™s response. And then everyone laughs at Ron Paul when he says he canâ€™t hear? Classy. Ron Paul deserves every bit of respect as the other candidates up there. Having his views, voice, and knowledge in our political system is certainly a blessing to this country.
Aside from that, I thought this debate sucked. The ABC News NH debate was MUCH better. The candidates spoke eloquently, and I enjoyed the questioning more. Why did Fox News ask the candidates what they would have done in the encounter with the Iranian speed boats the other day? Totally irrelevant. These guys are running for President, not General/Commander. Ridiculous. Watch the ABS News debate from New Hampshire, if you already haven’t. Much better. It made me proud to be a Republican, unlike last night’s debate which made me slightly embarrassed of the news station I watch and its unfair treatment of Ron Paul. The man has more to say but wasnâ€™t given the opportunity. In addition, most of the candidates seemed absent last night. I did, however, like how Fred Thompson stepped up to the plate. The other candidates were just mediocre. I expected more from Romney/McCain/Huckabee and Iâ€™m still waiting for Giuliani to surge.
Anyway, I like certain elements of every candidate and I wish I could combine all of them into a single “Super Candidate,” but of course that canâ€™t happen. Weâ€™ll see what happens.
Dem in MN if bringing up the positions held by the other contenders in the race makes you a smart aleck than more power to Mr. Thompson. I believe that the idea of the debates, is to point out the differences between the candidates? I love the debates as they give a chance for me to watch the candidate without any form of filter or spin being added to their statements (other tahn the time limits & sometimes rather liberally pointed questions that is.) Thats all I saw last night. If the candidate you prefer has some skeletons in the closet, or if he or she has a mixed record, thats where these kind of issues come out so that you as a voter can make an informed judgement as to which candidate most coresponds to your own beliefs, thus enableing you to make an informed choice when you go to the polls. I think that it was a good debate in that the candidates are begining to differentiate each other on different points. Thanks!
Frankly, I thought this debate was terribly mean-spirited. Despite what you think about Ron Paul, he didn’t deserve to be openly laughed at by his fellow candidates and the audience and castigated by the moderators! The question “Are you electable?” was totally uncalled for. I also didn’t like Thomson’s attack on Huckabee & Romney’s accusing Paul of “taking a page out of the Iranian handbook”. Just awful. Hats off to McCain, Huckabee, & Paul for at least being civil.
Nader in 2008!! oh wait, this year’s odd-ball wierdo choice is Ron Paul, the man with 2 first names.
Ron Paul in 2008!! (is that right?)
Seems like FOX tried to trap Ron Paul. I guess if you can’t exclude the guy, you can try to make him look crazy. The Iran answer certainly was bumbling, though. Is it an unreasonable theory that they messed with his earpiece? There are ways to make someone look crazy, and even if Paul isn’t right on a lot of things, he’s certainly got all of his marbles.
Wow. Either Huckabee knew the questions before hand, or he is awesome at putting together coherent answers on the fly. Well done!
@The Angry American
they dont even get a war-criminal trial…there is no trial at all! that is the flipping point.
someone mentioned that “the muslims” had to drop their reactionary ways. let me start by emphasizing that the majority of the muslim population do not engage in terrorist activity or agree with it. it is a small fraction within the muslim world that have anything to do with al kaida.
anti-american resentment is increased with guantanamo, irak war etc. the bush presidency made it really easy for maniacs like ahmedjinejad to raise anti-american sentiment. republicans are worsening the situation and have absolutely no clue and insight to their mistakes.
irak used to be a secular state, now its a haven for radical-terrorist-muslim extremists. congratulation to 8 years of the bush administration for making the world unsafer after 9/11 by attacking a country that wasnt involved in 9/11 (weapons of mass destruction- ya right), bin laden must be wetting his pants from laughter.
Mitt Romney isn’t at his best here. However, Romney still is the only one that has the understanding of economics we desparately need. McCain would be a great soldier but not the best president. The thing about having a strong military is that it requires money to pay for it. Only Romney can pull this country out of the imminent recession. I just hope he can get into the White House before it’s too late. Have you already thought about how you will pay your mortgage when the dollar is worth nothing?
To all Ron Paul supporters, try putting up canidates in local elections first, or try and get a few more congressmen and a couple of like minded senators elected before you seek the white house. Make Sense?
Mike Huckabee is still in the race and probably will win the presidential election simply because he has most of the right ideas, the right message. If some nincompoop does not understand that then he or she should not be even be a citizen of this country. Huckabee gets lots of kudos for his honesty, for this radical change message, speaking his mind and all that, which we all need in this country – CHANGE. He has the right message, ideas that will help this country. About Tax, IRS, Health Care, Education, Energy independence, Immigration. Not everything is perfect with Huckabee, but most of it his ideas are pretty cool and pretty vital, fundamental to this country. The only thing scary about Huckabee is that he was a baptist preacher. But I don’t think he enforces his believes on others, not even when he was the governor. I think he will make a great president. I wish him all the best. By the way to you all those critics of Huckabee I want to let you know that I am not even a Christian, so I am no evangelical this or that. I am just a good Citizen of this country who has made everything successful for myself and for my loved ones â€“ from almost nothing when I arrived in this country as a student with a high school diploma from my country seeking higher education in United States. I want a presidential candidate who will make this country to be classy, fair, strong and continue to have those values that has made this country great and continue to remain great in the future BUT with a CHANGE shedding the OLD (like spring house cleaning) and wearing the NEW. For that I believe Huckabee will help this country have a good head on its shoulders. You got THAT!
By the way, Ron Paul is great but the people and the country is not ready to hear and understand his message. One day Ron Paul’s message will be understood and embraced by the people of this country for sure. Love you Ron, but you go Huckabee!
aa your actually wrong, while most haven’t received anything, some have received military tribunals and have since been released. They are still holding many and I agree something should be done about it, but again bringing them to american soil to face the american court system isn’t the answer. What should happen is that they be turned over to the iraqi authorities and imprisoned and charged there by thier own people which is ultimately the long term goal, but it won’t happen until Iraq gets a grip on itself.
FYI, to Ron Paul /Co-conspirator supporters, the U.S. didn’t have an inside on the 9/11 disater, every angle has been investigated and disproven. No Ron Paul can’t change the minds of his followers but he can have the nuts to stand up and say I don’t appreciate people who think that way touting my name in support, because I don’t agree with them. It’s absolute lunacy. Paul is a “do nothing candidate” and doing nothing gets you exactly that kind of result, NOTHING. He doens’t want to fix anything, he wants to do nothing and thinks it will fix itself.
As for Hucksterbee, you can’t apply the passages of the bible to the government of the people and think it will solve everything. Go back to church, the bible says the passages are to teach us by us and by the church, not the President.
hey angry american did you pay as little attention to the four other candidates(gulliani,thompson,mccain,huckabee) who did not support a passive stance to iran, but the decision of the personel involved,wich happened to be passive. i heard them yes with my own ears, mess with us we\’ll bring the gates of hell,they were testing us,i don\’t believe the nie report and we cannot allow iran to develop a nuclear program, and finally maybe they are exporting explosive devices. the interviewer stating that paul\’s fellow candidates supporting a passive perspective causing the laughter you take petty delight in. i would submit that the opposite is true.
The Debate was one of the best to Date! Fred Thompson came out Smoking Hot. I hope he can keep up the momentum and continue to rise to the top. I truly feel that he is the only Conservative in the race. I do like Huckabee, that said he does not preach true conservative principals. During the Debate last night Huckabee proved his lack of competence pertaining to foreign policy. A great man of God but not the presidential candidate for 08′. I’ll stick with Fred.
I find it very interesting that after many years in Washington D.C. and many debates the only things John McCain seems to be able to brag about is a change in strategy in Iraq and an overpriced flying tanker. I would consider myself unsuccessful if after 25 years in Washington D.C. these items are the only thing I can brag about.
I watched the debate, and generally consider myself to be more of a leftist. however, this debate may have changed my views because of one man. Ron Paul. Hear me out before you dismiss me as an idiot democrat (independant actually). Ron Paul had very intelligent responses and handled himself with great class even when obviously attacked by the rest of the republicans. It was uncalled for the cameras to give glimpses of romney, mccain giving there stupid grins at the expense of Paul. This man would be great for our country. He lives by the constitution, believes in it, and also the golden rule. Remember his point as to why the terrorists attacked us? We attacked them! They didnt just seek us out because we were peacefully keeping to ourselves. We killed their families!. are we not doing the same now to them because they killed ours? Something needs to change. The other candidates dont seem to get that through their thick skulls. I dont neccessarily believe we should bring our troops home asap in the midst of a civil war, but Paul made a good point. Vietnam, we lost, we came home, we healed our wounds, and now we and Vietnam live in harmony. I go to college at Potsdam State, NY. Every year my advisor has a class trip to Vietnam (History major). Do you think we’ll ever have trips to Iraq if we continue to occupy and kill them? And do you think they would continue to kil us if we showed them some respect? How many schools did we built the Iraqi people to help educate them. Education is the way for peace. McCain may have said things were better in Iraq as he walked through the market place. But that was a LIE! He had a bullet proof vest on, he had snipers, he had the block barricaded. Don’t vote for the liars. Vote for the men who tell the truth. Vote for the man who actually admitted that our economy was going down the tubes and that our dollar was losing its value. You know who im talking about.
I agree with the Conservative Gal I thought Fred won it hands down. He is the only true conservative. After that I support Romney, Huckabee, McCain, Guiliani. In that order. I just could not support Paul as he would not defend the country or at least have the ability too if it were necessary. He would just start attacking our own citizens saying that is was our fault or something. Have you noticed how negative he is always?
If you don’t understand the reasons why the Muslims hate America and the west, just watch the movie/documentary titled Obsession. It is very interesting and informative. It can be found at http://www.obsessionthemovie.com, this helped me understand more of what is really going on and why. They have former PLO (Palestinian Liberation Organization) member and other converted Muslims (away from terrorism) who now live in America explain the ideology behind the hate. They also explain what tactics are used to incite all other Muslims to jihad. You don’t have to believe it if you don’t want to (aimed at Democrats and Ron Paul supporters) but just watch it and your eyes and minds might be opened a little more (but I’m not sure how much it can be) as was mine.
If you support Fred like I do consider going to his website at http://www.Fred08.com and hear his positions, there is lots of video on this, don’t just rely on debate material. We all will have to do a lot more work to make sure we elect the right person for this critical point in our nationâ€™s history. Everything is not as simple as Ron Paul wants us to believe it is (pull out and everyone will simply love us). Has he forgotten that we were not in the Middle East when we were attacked on 9/11??
We cannot allow the terrorists access to the courts, legal system and constitution that is meant for American citizens. First of all they are not criminals to be tried in court; they are enemy combatants like Hitler was. Should we have brought Hitler into our country to enjoy the rights of an American citizen? The other thing that they missed with Paul’s comment that we should have left Israel alone and all the other Arab nations back then and also now, is, what would have happened if we employed that philosophy back when Hitler was threatening and then started to take over Europe? Would they have just sorted out their own problems and everything would just be ok? No, Hitler was after world domination! AS ARE THE RADICAL ISLAMISTS!!
Attacked? With all due respect if Paul couldnt keep his wits about in the heat of a republican debate whats to make me think he could keep his wits when real problems face him as president with enemies who are hostile toward him and us? I was appalled at Ron Pauls showing. I wrote Fox to express anger at his omission from the previous debate and was awarded with what appeared to be a semi-deaf intelligently delusional man who couldn’t even answer a straight question.
As for poll of his winning the debate, it only shows the commitment he has from his followers. Those same crass followers who conducted themselves as liberal democrats would and pelted Hannity with snowballs. If Paul cannot reel in his follows during an election campain whats to make me think he can be a leader of my America?
All that said I agree with much of what Paul says. But that part of me that disagrees with Paul grew last night and that sliver of disagreement is enough to want to keep this man from being the President of the Untied States.
Wow, I couldn’t believe how much the commentators and even the camerawork and the sound levels were used to try to make Ron Paul look bad. We all know that Carl Cameron is a professional crankyanker, but in the debate even he managed to outdo himself when he asked Paul if he’s electable. Every other candidate on the stage has gotten single digits in at least one of the two primaries, and Paul has raised more money than some of them put together. Fox is a serious joke, and I hope that George Soros or someone like him will come along and offer an alternative network. Murdoch’s scatological festivities masquerading as news is an embarrassment to the American airwaves.
Thanks for agreeing “still for Fred” fan,
I actually have been a “friend of Fred’s” since the day he announced his candidacy. I logged in last night and donate to his campaign right after the debate. His politics were clear last night and now since Romney and McCain are focusing on Michigan, Fred can focus on S.C and FL. I have been tracking Fred’s activity this last week and a half and things I have heard are positive. Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity are giving him lots of air time along with Fox news and Mike Gallagher. He mentioned that Fred is the only TRUE CONSERVATIVE in the race. I just wish that Sean and Rush would come out and endorse him fully! If anybody is on the proverbially fence when it comes to supporting Fred I urge them to go to his website Fred08.com and check out his video messages. He updates weekly. His words are encouraging and calming in times of pure chaos.
Rush’s message today was on fire for Fred I hope that Nate gets a chance to post it. In Rush’s words “It was almost orgasmic”. Love that verbiage.
Ron Pauls message of non intervention is a sound policy. Our country has consistantly over the years undermined foreign governments by instilling and funding rebels. We spend billions and billions of dollars policing the world as our own infrastructure crumbles. We let International bankers control our economy and their loyalty is not to us but only to themselves. This country is going to hell in a handbasket because lobbies and foreign governments buy our politicians. The poor and the elite are skating on the backs of the disappearing middle class, we are in a recession, the dollar is spiraling downward and the one man with a clear head, integrity, moral conviction, 10 terms in congress never voting to raise taxes or expand government, gets laughed at by a despicable group of bought and paid for politicians and media propagandist mud slingers…. One thing about Ron Paul is the man will do what he says. He will not flip flop and he has the best interests of the American people in his heart.
Ron Paul is our only chance of any kind of privacy, can you folks not see government getting bigger & bigger every year. Look at your children people, just look at what our government is doing with our schools. I hear teachers complain constantly about the government enforced curriculum. We need less government control in our lives. Did you forget that government was put in to PROTECT us as americans not babysit & oversee all aspects of our lives. YOU NEED TO ASK YOURSELVES do you really feel safer knowing government keeps growing & growing forcing their ideals & policies down our throats no matter what. Every year we lose more freedoms & liberties. I urge a huge gut check. Just listen to Rons message, he is the only canidate from either side who is saying what I know most people to feel. Im not saying I agree with every aspect of his campaign, but he makes the best case of all, bar none. GO RON PAUL
What have the ruplicans done in that last 20 yrs. Starting with who seems to be a god for the rupublicans, Ronald Reagan, our national debt has exploded. Bush and Reagan alone have risen our debt from 2 trillion to 9 in only 3 terms! Clinton actually brought in a multi billion surplus. Paul is right, we do need to cut back on gov spending. We need to increase our domestic spending. Our school systems are failing largely thanks to no child left behind. Did you know that American kids rate next to last in the world in geography skills. Can you even tell me off the top of your head the nations bordering Iraq? If you can, then know that the vast majority of americans can not. What has this war on terrorism done for us? Are we really safer? Hell no! In fact we have lost numerous allies, our count is in the single digits currently (at least we have India), and terrorism is on the rise. We aren’t stopping anything, we are fueling it. Rudy needs to take a step back on his whole terrorism front and realize that Americans aren’t the only ones who have a right to vengence. I remember watching America bombing Baghdad on the news. Seeing families sitting on their roof tops watching the flames fall down. What was their response? They said they were used to it. Violence does not phase them like it does us, they are hardened to it. Why bother bringing more violence to them? We all admire Martin Luther King, but he promoted peace passively. Maybe we should give that a shot. Bush visited the Holocaust museum in Isreal this week and was moved by what he saw. He looked at Rice and asked “why didn’t we blow up the camps?” The guy only has violence on the mind, much like Rudy, and also has much ignorance. If we really wanted or knew the full effects of the holocaust we shouldnt have bombed the camps, but rather the railroads and supply lines. God help us if another Bush like republican gains control of the oval office. We need change people. Ron Paul seemed to be the only man who was voicing that opinion. Who cares if he has hearing problems and rambles. His responses were intelligent and insightful unlike the other candidates. You want to pick on him for hearing loss? Then pick on Bush for getting a lower SAT score than me, even though I was hung over. Pick on bush for not knowing correct vonacular. He doesnt even know how to use the english language and somehow he was voted into office!
Not to make excuses for Bush. Perhaps we simply should have asked the Nazi’s to stop? Would that suffice? If we stand down, pull back, become passive (as Paul would have us do using the excuse of the $) then other nations would grow more powerful and more aggressive to the point where they will demand what we have. If yo haven’t noticed the rest of the world (with few exception) can handly take care of themselves.
This is one of the longest threads I have seen on this website in months.
I agree with a few people on here, such as RD, who commented on how the questions were harsh. Many times they were loaded questions, which are unfair. They present the audience with the understanding that the questioner is right– and that the one being questioned needs to suddenly defend himself. While this happens in debates, it was done more often and more blatantly than I have seen thus far.
I cannot disagree more with Darren, who seems to feel that Democrats should not talk about Republicans. I am an Independent, so I guess I can ride the fence on these issues, but what is the problem with bipartisan communication? This is what we need in this country, not more walls or dividers. How do you hope for “Democrats” to change their minds– or for Republicans to change theirs, unless you have cross fertilization?
One other thing that this debate (and this long thread) has shown, is how divided the Republican base is still. There is no defining candidate– many people are die-hard for Thompson, Giuliani, Huckabee, Romney, Paul… and the flip-flopping in the national polls (look at how quickly Huckabee rose, and then how quickly McCain did), demonstrates this mutable — and thus unfocused — base.
The Republican party needs to find a voice soon. Elections are happening this year.
Here are the main points about the debate:
Fox tried to make Ron Paul look like an idiot by asking questions like “are you electable”, but it backfired on them. It was also unprofessional of Fox to not make certain that all participants could hear well.
Thompson’s virgins crack was out of line because he is assuming that all Iranians are terrorists… He was just trying to get a laugh after Huckabee said “Gate of Hell.”
Nothing much from Romney or Guliani, just rehashing their past laurels.
Ron Paul’s answers had substance and never vague. In fact, with his status as a counselor for the Von Mises institute, he was talking over everyone’s head.
I was happy to see that the South Carolinians voted for substance and not acting.
Excuse the spelling, this site could use a simple spell checker
I thought Ron Paul was treated unfairly, and I am not a Ron Paul supporter. The exclusion of him in the NH debate, and then the “electability” question. And I think he was responding to the position of the other candidates on Iran in general, not their comment on the passivity of the army in that one incident. He should be treated with respect. And while his foreign policy scares me, he deserves to be up there with the rest of the candidates. Remember Ross Perot? He received 19% of the vote after petitioners put him on the ballot. That should not be discounted.
I am not a Ron Paul supporter. I don’t think he’s a good presidential candidate and quite frankly, I wouldn’t vote for him. That said, I believe it was very disrespectful and unprofessional the way they treated him. Mr. Romney in particular really poked fun at him in a way that made me cringe, and you could see Ron Paul felt hurt by it. But more importantly, as a Jew who loves Israel with all my heart, I want to say that actually Ron Paul’s comments on Israel were very astute. While it may be somewhat of an insult to characterize Israel as a step child of the USA (which sparked the response from Guiliani), ultimately that is exactly how the USA has treated Israel – and not what Israel deserves.
Dr. Paul is right to raise the issue. If the US is a true ally of Israel, which it should be, why has the US funneled billions upon billions of dollars and weapons into arming the Arab countries who are Israel’s enemies? In addition, if it wasn’t for US meddling, the PLO terrorist group could have been dead as an entity a long time ago. And if it wasn’t for the US hand in resurrecting them and their thug leader Arafat in Tunis, they would not have gained such a stronghold in ‘Palestinian’ society. Without all those intifadas and terrorist attacks by Fatah under Arafat and Abbas, perhaps the refugee camps could have been opened up a long time ago and Israel could have helped Palestinians to real dignity (which the PLO/PA is not giving them and not interested in) a long time ago.
Ron Paul raised a good point that should be addressed honestly rather than simply dismissing him. Israel and the US can both benefit from a real partnership for countries with similar goals, but the US has largely extended some handcuffs in trying to assert its influence on the region and has ultimately hurt Israel’s people by giving so much support and weaponry to avowed enemies. Additionally, the land-for-peace agenda (which Bush has continued) that the US has been pushing for more than a decade now is not only seriously flawed in theory, but the results thus far on the ground have shown just how flawed and unrealistic it is, and his has only resulted in unnecessary bloodshed, and more misery for both Israelis AND Palestinians.
That being said, Ron Paul’s commen/joke about the Iranian speedboats and how the US could have crushed them easily is quite the naive statement. The USS Cole bombing was carried out by a weak defenseless little speedboat as well, loaded with explosives. If the captains of the US naval ships had decided to use a little less restraint and blown those Rev. guards into the atmosphere, I wouldn’t blame them even slightly.
This is what I got out of the debate: Romney is an empty suit with a great smile who tends to flip flop depending on which state he’s presently in. McCain is admirable because of his war record and being so inhumanely tortured in the POW camps, however, he claims that he would keep American troops in Iraq for a million years if need be? Common, give me a break. The guy will get us all nuked. Like Paul said, terrorist are happy that we’re on their soil because we are easier targets. Rudy, I also see him in much the same. Although he seems to be less inteligent (not to mention he divorced his 2nd cousin for his secretary-and then her for a journalist.. ps: his daughter is an Obama fan). Thompson seems like a blow hard who likes attacking the rest.. has some good points, but scares me a little. Huckabee seems like a decent fellow. I like that he’s doing so well for having raise a tenth of some of the other front runners. But he didnt answer the questions well enough for me.. seemed to try to defend himself more than anything (I was elected so many times so I must be doing something right.) Ron Paul made some excellent points, and although I doubt he has a chance, I hope he stays on a while just to promote more of his ideas and change some Republican policy in the process. And as for an above comment on Nazi germany and “should we have been passive with them?” that is rediculous. First of all Germany started invading countries, first of which was Poland, and had a leader who was trying to take over the world. Iraq is not trying to take over the world. And in the process committed great crimes against humanity. 9-11 was not done by the Iraqi government. Cant somebody get that through Rudy and McCain’s heads? Do me a favor and watch the new Tom Hanks movie “Charlie Wilsons War”. Wilson supplied the middle east with weapons so they could defend and defeat the Soviet union. Today those weapons are in the hands of these terrorist. However, at the end of the movie Wilson wants to build schools for these people because over half the population is under 14 yrs old. After spending a billion dollars supplying weaponry our government would not spare a few million for this project. What do you think education would have done for these children. Do you think educated people sell their lives for 200 dollars and become suicide bombers? We screwed up in the Reagan days, and are paying for it now. Why not learn from history?
This HBO documentary exposes the vulnerability of computers – which count approximately 80% of America’s votes in county, state and federal elections – suggesting that if our votes aren’t safe, then our democracy isn’t safe either. Watch it now here – http://www.digg.com/2008_.....ocumentary
hey jack shirley,
the vid of ron paul’s conservative credentials is included in the video.
They’re all idiots. Who doesn’t believe in EVOLUTION in this day and age.
I just want to know who it was singing the National Anthem.
I have to wonder what happened to the idea of fair and balanced reporting in the U.S. I have been watching news channels since the beginning of the great presidential race of 2008, and I have to say, this has been the worst and most unfair reporting I have ever seen. The blatant biasness of the news organizations is shown in their reporting, their disrespect for the political process, and the news castors biased and pompous and arrogant views. If I did not know any better, I would think the only candidates running for the nomination in the Democratic Party were Hillary and Obama, and the only candidates running for the republican nomination were McCain, Romney, Giuliani and Huckabee. To me, fair and balanced means giving all of the candidates an equal amount of time in front of the cameras. It doesnâ€™t mean you give the most time to the candidate who writes the biggest check. These news organizations have no respect for the political process and the candidates who have spent time as public servants, whether they were in state or federal positions. It seems that the organizations feel that they can decide who is going to win the race by making the candidates with the biggest checkbook more famous than the other candidates. The people who run these organizations have already picked the winning candidateâ€¦how about you? The news castors make me sick at times by trying to justify their arrogant view, and forcing their opinions on the American people. Itâ€™s no wonder that other countries see U.S. citizens as arrogant and pompous. Look at what they see on world news. Fair and balanced no longer exists within the U.S. national and world news media. Look at the way Ron Paul was treated during the SC Republican debate. How ridiculous can FOX get? What ever happened to reporting the facts and leaving speculation out of the news? I thought that kind of thing was left to the editorialists. No wonder Andy Rooney is not on TV that much anymore, the broadcast media is full of people who are transmitting their opinions across the airwaves. I guess the old saying was rightâ€¦.â€No news is good news.â€ Now we have 3 major channels with nothing but news 24 hours a day. What does that tell you? It tells you that we as Americans may be better informed, but at what price. Media sets the price. How much are the candidates willing to pay in order to make sure we only listen to them? If you want to know, ask the news channelsâ€¦theyâ€™ll ask you how much you are willing to pay for the information. Just rememberâ€¦news organizations and television stations are businesses. Their primary goal is to make money.
Ron Paul has got me hooked 1000%
In the beginning of change, the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for it costs nothing to be a patriot.â€
A man strings together long chains of poetic but meaningless phrases, such as “the audacity of hope” and “the urgency of now.” He speaks constantly of change, but the nature of this change remains undefined. His words are full of “sound and fury,” but “signify nothing.” Nevertheless, he is hailed not merely as a man, nor as a candidate, but as a movement.
A woman almost cries. It is a tiny expression of emotion born of a wounded ego. She fears the loss of the chance to control the lives of millions, and to bend them to her highly personal vision of what they need. Beyond this the tears say nothing, and mean nothing, but thousands swoon and she is rewarded with victory.
Another man states a willingness to keep American troops in Iraq for 100 years — a policy that will inflame the patriotic and religious emotions of a billion Muslims. And yet, he is hailed as a sober man, perhaps uniquely qualified to protect you from the very forces he promises to incite. Many members of the media freely admit that this man’s main constituency is the media itself. After all, he has no money, because no one cares to give him any, but the media’s cheer-leading is enough to lift him to victory.
Meanwhile, another man is largely ignored by the media. He is rarely mentioned in the same breath as the “Audacious Hoper,” the “Tearful Egotist,” or the “100-year spiller of other people’s blood.” And yet, he has many millions of dollars, because hundreds of thousands of people cared to give it to him. This man has run for president before. He was ignored by everyone then, but he is supported by many now. The difference is the label he runs under. Only that, and little more. His positions remain mostly the same. Only the label has changed.
Look around. Take notice. People vote for reasons having nothing to do with issues, beliefs, philosophy, or ideology. They vote because of poetry, tears, media cheer-leading, and labels. This happens because people do not care for their votes, which cost them little, in the same way that they care for their money. They may not give a man who favors a hundred year war their cash, but they will give him their vote, even when they oppose his war.
Votes are treated like bets. They are like cheers at a sports arena. The evidence for this is very clear. And yet, so many of us act as if changing how people vote will change the world.
No, changing minds is what will change the world.
Invest your time and money attempting to win votes, and no matter how much ground you think you’re gaining, at the last minute you will lose your entire investment to poetic sounds, egotistical tears, empty labels, or the sports cheers of the media. And many of the minds you may have changed in the process will snap back to their old positions, because you lost the vote.
But invest your time and money to change minds directly, and you will gain the world. The votes may even follow. But be under no illusions, the votes will merely follow, they will never lead. Electoral success will be the last thing that happens in the process of change, not the first. Grasp this fact, or you will groan forever in futile effort and constant despair.
This is our manifesto.
For centuries African-Americans had to enter buildings through side doors, but now it is possible that an African American will enter the White House itself, through the front door. This didn’t happen because people were specifically elected to make it happen. It happened because minds were changed, and the votes followed.
For long years a woman’s place was in the kitchen, but now her place is anywhere and everywhere she chooses, perhaps even the Oval Office. This didn’t happen because anyone was elected to make it happen. It happened because minds were changed.
Martin Luther King didn’t run candidates and elect them to office. He, and the brave men and women who suffered under the fire hoses and the biting dogs, changed minds through the example of their courage and peaceful suffering.
Gandhi didn’t elect a slate of candidates to vote the British out of India. Ghandi changed minds, including the minds of the British, and then the British left.
The Berlin Wall, and the communist governments of eastern Europe, didn’t fall because new legislatures were elected to make them fall. The change happened because minds changed, including the minds of soldiers who decided to no longer obey orders.
We don’t have cheap air travel and shipping today because someone was specifically elected to make those things happen, we have them because the people in power became intellectually convinced that it would be good to deregulate trucking and air travel.
Congressman Walter Jones, a man who supported the Iraq war so passionately that he wanted to change the name of French Fries to Freedom Fries, didn’t switch to opposing the war because his conservative constituents re-elected him for that purpose. His policy changed because his mind changed in the face of the evidence.
In the long run, people hit only what they aim at. As long as we aim mainly at votes our arrows will constantly pass through a cloud of smoke — a cloud that is blown this way and that by the gusts from media windbags. But if we aim at changing minds, our arrows will begin to hit home, and cause real, lasting change.
This is our aim. And we hope to make it your aim too. We want to change people’s minds about what is needed strategically, in order to more effectively cause a change in people’s philosophy of government.
To change minds we must make the case for small government seen and heard by everyone, everywhere, every day. It really is that simple.
What would it take in terms of time and money to convince the people of the need for things like the “Read the Bills Act,” and the “One Subject at a Time Act?” What would it take to convince people to not be afraid of terrorism? The answer to these questions provides the target we need to hit.
In this regard we want to bring to your attention the fact that the British government has decided to no longer talk about a “war on terror.” This hardly represents a fundamental change in government policy, but it does reflect a change in the beliefs of British leaders. It is a step in the direction of our “I am not afraid” campaign. We need to convince our own leaders to take the same first step.
I am switching my vote from McCain to Thompson. He has spoken consistently about solutions to the issues and has even put specifics on his web site. McCain can’t even speak consistently on his “I saved the taxpayers $$$ on a bogus tanker deal……..” I think last month it was 2 Billion dollars, now its 6 Billion??? WTH??? Maybe we are paying interest every time he points it out!
Ron Paul said “5 gun boats against a US Destroyer? We could take care of them in 5 seconds.” Was he sleeping when one little rubber boat killed 17 US sailors and injured 39 others??? Remember the USS Cole??
Does anybody else see through this sells pitch that Mit is putting on. He is a business man…LOOKING FOR PROFIT…that is what they do. Look at his track record. He has NOT had a continueous opinion since the day he entered. Im insulted, just as those in SC should be also.
to matt2112: you have my vote. that was poetic and beautifully stated. 1.15.08.4:52
(I mean, “go Ron Paul”).
you guys re: USS Cole:
so we learned a lesson there. and the 5 speedboats didn’t get close enough. did the floating boxes? kudos to the captains for restraint on renegade Iranian fanatics who want us to war with Iran. they have averted WW3, for now. don’t you think if ALL our troops were here that we could defend ourselves just fine? at home? don’t you think that when they “slip” through the borders that nukes will be launched from our neighbor’s backyards to ours that we will NEED our troops here to defend ourselves here? hmmmm?
BTW, tragic to lose ANY lives to terrorism. again, that would be reduced by not being there.
“Has [Ron Paul] forgotten that we were not in the Middle East when we were attacked on 9/11??”
HA! Such naivety. We weren’t in the middle east, huh? Tell that to the Saudis and the Israelis, and well.. every nation in the middle east. We have been there for a LONG time, my friend. The argument isn’t that they hate us because we use military force… just having military personnel on holy land incites furor. Those in the middle east who despise America hate us because WE ARE THERE. Ask any person who lives there. I bet that nine times out of ten you will get a response like this: “The United States’ arrogant foreign policy is the principle source of derision among peoples of the middle east.” I just read an article by an Israeli Ron Paul supporter the other day who basically (I’m paraphrasing) says just that. He became a Paul supporter because he is astute enough to recognise that only Dr. Paul understands this fundamental fact about US foreign policy.
The United States government, through military forces and CIA, have toppled elected officials and installed military dictators more than once in the last half-century. LISTEN to the people who despise America. Perhaps a small number of them simply dislike America’s foundation of individual liberty or the idea that a woman could lead a nation, but you must be delusional if you can’t see that the majority hate us because of our arrogance, particularly when that arrogance extends to deploying armies to shove a boot up someone’s ass. As of 2002, we have over 700 bases in 130 countries around the world and US troops in about 150 countries, including every middle eastern country save Iran. How much clearer can I make it? WE ARE AN EMPIRE. All empires eventually fall.
Most people I talk to vote for who they think have a chance at winning. So they can be on the winning side. Or the one who looks nice. “I can’t vote for him, he doesn’t have a chance to win.”, is what I hear a lot of. And those of you who do not research the candidates past and what they previously voted for, are among those impulse voters that degrade, debase, and destroy democracy. And really now days with electronic voting machines, will our vote really count anyway? What is America and what is it based on? Freedoms, liberty, personal choice, and pursuit of happiness. I have seen so many good politicians say this and say that and sound so nice in running, then when they win turn about face and do just the opposite of what they promised. Our present leaders included. Our countries people are now in the state of fear, loss of freedoms, lack of prosperity, and pursuit of American dream long gone. People, do you want the government to take care of you? I already pay 25 bucks a week for some sort of tax that I cannot explain. And that is just a fraction of the deductions they take from me. A vote for any one of these paid spokespersons for the C.F.R., except Ron is a vote for higher tax, more tax, more loss of freedoms, more government control of your life, period. Regardless of what they say right now, and how good they make it sound. I for one want to see freedoms restored, my earnings restored, ability to buy land without permission restored. Sending my kids to a school that isn’t agenda-ized by D.O.E. , restored. Jobs brought back to America from China. So we can prosper. Troops brought home to their families. I don’t fear terrorism, as I do not believe the propaganda the big media tells us. Look at the facts, and learn the truth. The television lies! Only one up there will do this for us. Restore freedoms. Please, people vote for the one who you know in your heart is the right one, taking a look at what it means to be American and free.
Vote Huckabee! This kinda guy is what our country was founded on!
Very nice information. Thanks for share.Look forward to reading more from you in the future.
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